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Ignition barrel replacement

Started by nathan, 30 December 2021, 10:29 AM

nathan

Hi guys,

the ignition barrel on my 6.9 started to stick lately, and having had a disaster on my 123 resto, I knew I would not leave this too long!

Unfortunately, barrels seem to be NLA, even after market.

There are some 123 barrels but from my experience, these should not fit, although they do look very similar to the 116 barrel?

Does anyone have any thoughts on sourcing a new barrel?

I made a brief video on barrel removal for anyone else having a go at removal and replacement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfi2j5jXTEM

regards
Nathan
6.9 79 #6436
6.9 79 #6290
6.9 79 #6181
6.9 78 #4764
6.9 77 #3096
6.9 76 #1741
6.9 76 #0902
6.9 75 #0018

ptashek

Are aftermarket ones available?

On the W124 you can buy a few aftermarket Febi barrels, and build one matching the original key. Might be possible with the W116 as well.

You cold try getting a new key, if the old one is worn. Or add some graphite or moly powder to lubricate the pins again.
1993 "Pearl Blue" W124 280TE
1988 "Arctic White" W124 200T
1979 "Icon Gold" W116 450SE

nathan

Cheers PT,

I think the only aftermarket 116 one is a URO which would be an absolute last resort (in fact Id rather never drive the car again).

Correct me if Im wrong PT, I thought the barrel wears, not the key so you cant really get another key cut? Ive also heard you can no longer get the correct blanks anymore. 

The used one I have is working well but Id rather a new one as you never know how long the other one will last.

Ill update if any findings

regards

Nathan
6.9 79 #6436
6.9 79 #6290
6.9 79 #6181
6.9 78 #4764
6.9 77 #3096
6.9 76 #1741
6.9 76 #0902
6.9 75 #0018

Pete49

I sourced a new blank on ebay last year for my '75 450 SEL as the silca version wasn't available. I retired from locksmithing early 2000 but still keep up with it to a degree. The key number is M79S but the makers name is too worn to read so will see if I can find you more info. If the drivers door doesn't have a problem opening with the key it will be a worn ignition barrel wafers but a bugger to separate barrel from lock body.I did a w123 some years ago but forgot the method.
Pete
What this country needs are more unemployed politicians.
Edward Langley,  Artist (1928-1995)

nathan

Thank you Pete,

Am I right in saying that barrel cant really be repaired?  I didnt think it could once we got to this point?  I understand the Silcas are NLA now!
6.9 79 #6436
6.9 79 #6290
6.9 79 #6181
6.9 78 #4764
6.9 77 #3096
6.9 76 #1741
6.9 76 #0902
6.9 75 #0018

ptashek

Up until last year it was possible to order VIN matched original keys from the dealership. Might be worth checking if they are still available.

You just need to present proof of ownership.

If they key is worn and you're stuck with no master key to cut from, options become much more limited.

As for rebuilding the barrel, you just use the pins from the aftermarket part and fit matching ones  back into the original barrel. It may extend the lifetime of the existing key.
1993 "Pearl Blue" W124 280TE
1988 "Arctic White" W124 200T
1979 "Icon Gold" W116 450SE

ptashek

Aftermarket blanks were made by Silca, and factory keys were made by Huf (also modern replacements).
1993 "Pearl Blue" W124 280TE
1988 "Arctic White" W124 200T
1979 "Icon Gold" W116 450SE

rumb

Not sure why bashing URO ignition cylinder in particular.  Do you have hands on experience with this specific part or just internet research of general URO parts from years ago? It's well known that a few early parts - especially rubber - were not any good. The company pulled several of those parts from the market and they have been on top of insuring higher quality since then. They are a OEM supplier to Mercedes. As Mercedes ceases production of parts like this URO is stepping in to keep our cars on the road.

Anyone interested in getting a new URO lock and keys for free let me know, I can probably arrange for one in exchange for an honest review later. PN 1164620279
'68 250S
'77 6.9 Euro
'91 300SE,
'98 SL500
'14 CLS550,
'16 AMG GTS

nathan

PT, factory keys are not available any more.  I asked Tom (who recently retired!) at the CC and he said NLA.

Rumb, I would avoid any URO part until the consensus changes, as I've never had a trusted mechanic suggest URO supply quality products. 
Perhaps this will change like Japanese or Korean car maker reputations of the past, but for now, they have earned their 'reputation'.
Do you or a close friend work for URO rum, as how do you obtain free URO parts in exchange for reviews?
6.9 79 #6436
6.9 79 #6290
6.9 79 #6181
6.9 78 #4764
6.9 77 #3096
6.9 76 #1741
6.9 76 #0902
6.9 75 #0018

Pete49

I would love to accept the offer of a free lock however I have no need for one yet so hopefully the offer will be taken up and an honest review is given to remove doubts.
I have never removed and examined a W116 ignition to see if they are repairable like the door and trunk/boot locks.Pete
What this country needs are more unemployed politicians.
Edward Langley,  Artist (1928-1995)

UTn_boy

You're going to have to be more specific on which lock cylinder your car has.  The 6.9 came with three different versions over the years of production; the first two were the standard type that used a key with two sides cut. The first version was used from chassis number 000001 to 004157, part number 601-460-03-04.  The second version was used from chassis number 004158 through 005181, part number 116-462-07-79.  The third version was the high security version with inversely cut patterns on the sides of the key.  This 3rd version was used from chassis number 005182 until production stop in 1980.  Part number 116-460-06-04. 

The first two version lock cylinder key blanks and keys cut to the car's VIN are still available.  The third version with the high security key and lock cylinder is where the trouble starts.  You can still order keys cut to your car's VIN, but you can no longer get a lock cylinder.....either for the ignition or the doors.  URO is the only place making a replacement for the third version. 

Two years ago, my Father's 1979 450sel, which has the 3rd version high security locks on it, had the ignition lock cylinder fail on it.  It was either pay $100 for a new URO reproduction or $800 for a genuine Mercedes one I had found on ebay.  Both my father and myself agreed that the ebay seller didn't deserve to be given any patronage due to their excessive greed.  So we took a chance on the URO.  Once it came in, I had to take it apart to make my Father's original key fit.  (He didn't want the hassle of two keys to his car).  That all went well, and the URO lock cylinder worked very well.......for about a year.  Then it failed.  Again, we had to order another URO.  We literally had no other choice.  This time we got one where the seller offered a lifetime warranty on the cylinder.  So far so good, but the URO ones are very inferior to the originals.  They look cheap, feel cheap, and operate cheaply feeling.  But again, at this point we had no other alternative.  Sure, used is always a viable option, but that would be like buying a used light bulb.  It may last a day or two years.  Not worth the gamble/risk.   
1966 250se coupe`, black/dark green leather
1970 600 midnight blue/parchment leather
1971 300sel 6.3, papyrus white/dark red leather
1971 280sel Black/black leather
1973 300sel 4.5, silver blue metallic/blue leather
1979 450sel 516 red/bamboo

robertd

Hi Nathan,

I have a few NOS barrels on the shelf.  or some used ones from previous parts cars.

give me a call at your convenience.

Happy New Year

Robert
116   1978 450SEL 6.9 #  4848
116   1979 450SEL  6.9 # 5884
116   1979 450SEL  6.9 # 6225  SOLD
116   1978 450SEL  6.9 # 5128  SOLD
116   1979 450SEL  6.9 # 5884  SOLD
116   1974 450SEL  DJet

nathan

Cheers UTN, an in-depth run down.  Mine is the last one for #6436.

I dont like using 'used', but think ill take my chances over a URO one.  Neither are ideal situations.  Im told you cant get new keys cut for any model after asking at local dealer and the classic centre.  Some had suggested the Silka blanks are NLA.  Ive scanned ebay and may cough up the dollars for a new one unless....

RD, I will buzz you. If you have a new one thats awesome. 

Regards
Nathan
6.9 79 #6436
6.9 79 #6290
6.9 79 #6181
6.9 78 #4764
6.9 77 #3096
6.9 76 #1741
6.9 76 #0902
6.9 75 #0018

Harv

Have you tried giving it a proper cleaning and re-greasing it with clear dielectric grease?

Once a year I take my barrel out, dunk it in cleaner, clean everything with a fine tooth brush, then reassemble with dielectric gear in every part of the barrel. That usually keeps it nice and smooth with no sticking.
1980 300SD
1983 240D
2000 E55 AMG
2002 G500

nathan

I havent given it the clean Harv,
Im not sure if ever replaced, im the second owner.  The irony is Ive been having a few starting issues over the last year, first the transmission bushings (i replaced), then the starter solenoid played up (replaced), and now the ignition barrel.  the 116 gods are trying to hinder me! I just see the sticking key as a sign its on its way out and though i'd replace it, but its worth a shot of cleaning it out.

ultimately, a new barrel of any OEM sort would be fine.  I appreciate UTN suggesting the first gen ones werent as secure, but im not too phased about my 6.9 getting stolen (maybe famous last words!).  it sits in a monitored garage and only gets driven to car events every month or two. if someone wants to take it, they are probably going to take it.

6.9 79 #6436
6.9 79 #6290
6.9 79 #6181
6.9 78 #4764
6.9 77 #3096
6.9 76 #1741
6.9 76 #0902
6.9 75 #0018