Hmmmph. What is the difference between a 280S and 280SE?

[John Hubertz]

Both were offered from 72 through 80...  both had the M110 engine... same specs and trans.

What was it, carpet?  More flex in the window regulator mechanisms and less in the seatpads?

Couldn't have been the ol' einspritzen...  cuz they wuz ALL einspritzed after 76 or so, yes?

[Andrew280SEL]

Well other than what you've already mentioned (not sure about the flex part though, haha), for starters I think 280S' were the just the carburetor (spelling?) fitted models 
While the 280SE's and all other models up were fuel injected.

I'm pretty sure all 280S' were non-fuel injected, as I think the "E" on all the model badges signifies fuel injection.

[oscar]

carburetor spelling - carb.  Can't go wrong

There's been few posts from people with 280S build dates greater than 1976.  I know the manual only shows the dates 75 and 76 but that might be US specific.  Perhaps in the US all were FI after 1976. 

But apart from the carb v's d-jet or k-jet, I'm not sure if the standard and optional list varied between them.

But the typical 280S seems less equipped than the 280SE.  To give an idea here's what I've noticed about the typical 280S  that differs from the usual 280SE (d-jet and/or k-jet) things I've noticed are -

Thin door cards as opposed to the bulkier ones seen in the V8's and most 280se's (excluding South African w116's, all had thin door cards so the RSA folks tell us)
No tacho
Manual windows
If MB tex seats, they're usually the moulded seem type, not the stitched type.

There's so many exceptions to the rule eg hovaness posted the other day about a sunroof in his 280S.  None of mycars has one. The yellow 280se I wrecked had manual windows.  The brown one had electric, but both had tachos.  Cruise Control is in the brown one only.  Although I thought manual transmissions were standard, there seems to be very few around.  But the list goes on..... There is a brochure from 73 that lists options and standards.  I know a few people have got it and have quoted from it.  I've got one but can't find it but if I do I'll try and post the list. It will hopefully differentiate between the 280S and 280d-jet.

[John Hubertz]

Take a look at the 280S on ebay I posted - it has just about everything my SEL does, AND a sunroof...  color coordinated dash, tachometer, but perhaps yes, under that oval aircleaner a carburetor might indeed lurk.

More like "lurch"  carbureted USA specification early-emissions vehicles have a near-universal problem called "trailer hitching".  So hideous and inbuilt was this driveability flaw that 1977 - 1979 carbureted and fuel injected vehicles are almost never seen on the road.  The few that still live have carburetor conversions - as the fueling issues caused incredibly terrible engine wear problems, and most ethical installers will put a modern holly or some such in place of the original.

Even emissions improves - the only thing these overlean/undriveable monsters ever did was marginally raise the window-sticker highway fuel economy.

[oscar]

The air cleaner's definitely a carb version air cleaner.  It could only be used for a carb since the other two types of intakes are located in different spots.  K-jet's further forward and lower, d-jet even more forward and a barrel like air cleaner. 

It's a nice car, and yeah, I can see a number of features akin to a 450sel.  Apart from what you've mentioned the electric windows, air con might have been an option too, the seats are MB Tex IMO not leather like the seller says but they are the sewn type not moulded pleats, plus there's thick door cards as well.  Some things missing that would be on a 450sel, there appears to be no cruise control or self levelling rear suspension. 

That aside, it's surprising to see a highly optioned 280S.  That brochure I have, I remember it features photos of a 350se and although sporting a sunroof (which I thought would be an expensive addition), it still has a manual trans, manual windows, no air con and a large clock with no tacho.  My thinking is that there were so many options that'd there's som many feature combinations out there.  So some 280S vehicles may even outspec some 280se's

[John Hubertz]

Yep.    The carb, tex and carpet level are the only real differences - and the lack of metallic paint.

All USA cars had cruise - see the pic over the driver's seat edge and you can see the stalk.

That car is an unbelievable bargain if the Solex makes it run OK.

[oscar]

All USA cars had cruise - see the pic over the driver's seat edge and you can see the stalk.

Ah it is too!   

[koan]

Is it that the 280S was built to a basic specification in the particular market and the trim was what they at had at the time? If there was an excess of instrument clusters with tachos or padded door trims thats what they got.

koan

[Papalangi]

Take a look at the 280S on ebay I posted - it has just about everything my SEL does, AND a sunroof...  color coordinated dash, tachometer, but perhaps yes, under that oval aircleaner a carburetor might indeed lurk.

More like "lurch"  carbureted USA specification early-emissions vehicles have a near-universal problem called "trailer hitching".  So hideous and inbuilt was this driveability flaw that 1977 - 1979 carbureted and fuel injected vehicles are almost never seen on the road.  The few that still live have carburetor conversions - as the fueling issues caused incredibly terrible engine wear problems, and most ethical installers will put a modern holly or some such in place of the original.

Even emissions improves - the only thing these overlean/undriveable monsters ever did was marginally raise the window-sticker highway fuel economy.

Trailer hitching?  All this time I thought it was just lumps in the gas.

My '87 5.0 Mustang with speed density FI did this while crawling at idle.  The solution?  Smack the pedal to the floor and hope you hit second gear before it blew up or the rear end smacked the car next to you.

Michael

[Martin 280s]

I think the technical difference between the 280S and SE is that the SE has fuel injection and a Tacho fitted (although i've seen without) and the cylinder head is slighty different. As for the specification, that all depended on how much the customer wanted to spend.

In Brazil, it's not to common to see Ss with higher specs than SEs due to the fact mechanics weren't accustomed to fuel-injection and autoboxes so the carburettor and manual box were much more popular.

[John Hubertz]

Well, all USA models got tachometers, cruise, sunroofs and lousy performance...  they pre-built them and it was FOREVER for a special order, as the Government used to emissions-inspect EVERY CAR.

That's why euro delivery cars are usually the only ones with options - like Max with his extra headroom (no sunroof) and ortho seats.

That's why I've only seen 2 116s in USA trim with velour.  And I detest the feel of leather.

What a whiner I am!  I'm hardly manly enough to DESERVE a brown car!

[pompy]

Here in the old South of Africa I've seen high spec'd 280 S's (with carbs only), albeit late models ie. '79, '80 with elec windows, sunroof, a/c, a/t, cruise, tach, rear head rests, full wood, alloys - leather was std accross the range since the introduction. But we didn't have SLS and zooty door cards.

For some reason I find a high spec base model like this very appealing

[s class]

Here in South Africa both 280S and SE were supplied up till the end.  Our market got euro spec cars, so the 280SE was 185hp and the 280S down at 160 I think. 

There are othere differences - the 280S had a shorter diff than the 280SE, and so the 280S is usually quicker in the 0 to 50km/h stakes, whereafter the greater torque of the injected motor tells.  The 280S is a bit of a screamer on the open road  - remember our speed limit is 120km/h plus a bit of tolerance....

[Martin 280s]

Pompy, me too!
In fact I think it's better to preserve the 'lesser' but higher spec models since the majority are after the top-of-the-range models. One day there won't be any good 'lesser' model on the market and what's left will be in the hands of avid collectors unlike a relatively abundant supply of T-o-t-Range cars...Well, that's my view anyway!

[craigb]

Going by chassis no, I have a 1980 280s - South African, manual, the wider door trims, cloth check interior (mb tex edges), electric windows and air con.   I should try again to get the data card for the car, because going by what is on here, all that is fine but shouldn't have the wider door trims, but they do match the seats, and the interior trim it joins to, and the carpet colours etc all seem to match, but I suppose it is possible an entire interior was grafted into it - doesn't feel like it though and all feels pretty original.

As for diff ratio, I measured it and it is around 3.7, which I thought was the same for the SE. I have receipts for a rebuilt diff so perhaps they swapped in another ratio? What ratio do you think it should be?