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Community => The ORG => Topic started by: oscar on 27 February 2007, 04:12 PM

Poll
Question: Pick One Only
Option 1: H votes: 7
Option 2: S votes: 1
Option 3: T votes: 14
Title: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 27 February 2007, 04:12 PM
H   (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/h.jpg.html)S (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/Badge-Test0aclear.jpg.html)   T (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/Badge-Test0acleargold1+_Medium_.jpg.html)

Highest 3 badges polled in the previous poll have been put forward again.  Please choose one badge only.  Badge with the highest count will be used.  Of course, artwork has to be finalised but they do a pretty good job on representing what they should look like.

Wording will be:  INTERNATIONAL OWNERS' GROUP up the top and W116.ORG down the bottom.

Once the count's in we can approach the badgemaker again and nut out the production, payment and shipping details.

The poll's only short, 6 days and you can change your mind along the way.
Regards,
Simon.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 02 March 2007, 03:00 AM
Friendly reminder, less than half have returned to vote.  Only 4 days to go.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Des on 02 March 2007, 03:05 AM
They are all really good, but in the end I picked H
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Martin 280s on 02 March 2007, 05:45 AM
It's got to be T for me!
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Mforcer on 03 March 2007, 03:11 PM
How many T (and S) voters would change their mind with a better, cleaner, clearer image of the car in the centre of the badge?
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 03 March 2007, 05:30 PM
Mforcer, it's interesting split atm.    Do you have a clearer pic like the site logo?  I can incorporate it on the silver and the gold designs if you like to see what it looks like.  Post it here or email me simnat@ozemail.com.au .  Don't finish work till after 6pm so expect the examples some time after that.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Mforcer on 04 March 2007, 06:39 AM
It is a very interesting split at the moment, especially considering that I have not voted yet :P

Unfortunately, I don't have the original artwork for the logo apart from the image shown on this site :( I tried to contact the creator but they have disappeared not long after the site was created.

The reason for my previous post was that with the current badge choices, my pick would be T but I would still prefer to see the outline of a W116 used like the site logo. The current image of the car just doesn't appeal to me. I also don't like the star peaking out from behind the car as it isn't at all clear what it is.

If we could get some feed back as to why people don't like the badge they didn't vote for, we may be able to come up with a design that doesn't split the vote so evenly. Either that or I open up a whole can of worms.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 04 March 2007, 07:46 AM
Quote from: Mforcer on 04 March 2007, 06:39 AM
If we could get some feed back as to why people don't like the badge they didn't vote for, we may be able to come up with a design that doesn't split the vote so evenly. Either that or I open up a whole can of worms.

ABSOLUTELY!   ;) Speak up people!

I've stared at the images for so long whilst playing with them it's hard to distinguish between pros and cons.  I'd hate to see a 50/50 split with maybe one vote deciding.  I'd rather a major majority happy with a final design.  Then again, so many have said they will buy whichever design is made.  I've always wanted an image of the car on the badge but I voted T as well.  My favourite still remains the H and T conglomeration, ie the gold with car that wasn't included.  I have a copy of this site's pic above.  I shall have a fiddle with it to redraw the lost lines and see what I can do.




EDIT EDIT:
I couldn't quite finish the site's logo.  Instead I pinched a few poses from the gallery to look at more angles of the car, some that matched or came close to the site logo.  Here's what I found. 
Unless the car is at a flat stance like what appears in H, the car appears off centre and covers the star moreso.  Forget the detail as such and think of the outline of the shape.  I too would like to see the car outline but in my opinion, the star would have to go.  In that regard I shall stick with T. 

I didn't save all the examples I threw together and didn't have a blank silver badge to play with hence the gold ones.  These two are of OBH's Boris Benz.  The paintwork is absolutely stunning :)
Regardless, one can see how one part of the star is consistently hidden no matter how I manipulated the car.

(http://img177.imageshack.us/my.php?image=badgeboris2mediumsmallpq7.jpg) (http://img177.imageshack.us/my.php?image=badgeborismediumsmallky5.jpg)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Mforcer on 04 March 2007, 05:15 PM
Well, I have cast my vote :)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 04 March 2007, 05:40 PM
That's cool, that's cool.

I was just campaigning in a roundabout way. :)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Brian Crump on 04 March 2007, 06:12 PM
Really what I am saying is this; The designs are fantastic. The people who have put so much work into the designs are fantastic. I like them both designs and will be totally happy with whatever people want. I am amazed at how successful this group is - in my experience, this group is tops for action, value and know-how. There is no other group as GR8 as the 116.org.
Well done chaps!!
BC
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Martin 280s on 05 March 2007, 05:20 AM
All the designs we've had so far have been superb. My choice is T. But, for the life of me, I don't understand why you'd want a badge for the forum with a picture of the car on a badge when the badge is attached to said car, Isn't it a bit redundant ? You wouldn't put the badge on anyother car would you?
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 05 March 2007, 07:40 AM
8 and a bit hours to go, T has pulled way out in front with twice as many votes.  I don't think we have to worry about the car.  Or have I spoken to soon :-[

Martin, I saw your pics in the members section for the first time today.  Stunning car  8) I hadn't noticed how good it looked before. Well done.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Martin 280s on 05 March 2007, 07:41 AM
Quote from: oscar on 05 March 2007, 07:40 AM
8 and a bit hours to go, T has pulled way out in front with twice as many votes.  I don't think we have to worry about the car.  Or have I spoken to soon :-[

Martin, I saw your pics in the members section for the first time today.  Stunning car  8) I hadn't noticed how good it looked before. Well done.

Thanks, Oscar...I'm fond of her too ;D ;D
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 05 March 2007, 05:48 PM
That's it,

T is officially our badge.

Wording
INTERNATIONAL OWNERS' GROUP up the top and W116.ORG down the bottom. I'm waiting to get feedback on the screw holes but I've thrown them in.
It's on imageshack. I'll throw another version in the gallery soon for all to see.  I've run out of time and have to go to work in 13 mins :o


Looks good yeah ;) click for bigger view.


EDIT
BTW, I'd imagine the srews will be bigger.    oops 10mins,,,, see ya

(http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=finishbadgemediumvh9.jpg)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Mforcer on 05 March 2007, 06:03 PM
Well done everyone and especially Oscar! The badge is going to be fantastic!
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 05 March 2007, 07:55 PM
Guys, dont forget Andrew116 too.  I'd like to mention him especially as most of the badges are basically his creations, some were untouched and the rest were the result of me discovering what photoshop could do to them.  But thanks to everyones kind words in this and the other threads.

Unfortunately I can't link the gallery photo as I can't generate code however, anyone will be able to see the badge at this link:

http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/finishbadgemediumvh9.jpg.html?g2_enterAlbum=0 (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/finishbadgemediumvh9.jpg.html?g2_enterAlbum=0)

Still looks a bit rough but you get the idea.  NB, the dot between the w116 and ORG should be centred.


So what now?
Stay tuned whilst we set the wheels in motion for the next step. Cheers.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: gregdeklerk on 06 March 2007, 12:06 AM
Thanks to all concerned for all the hard work.

Greg
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 06 March 2007, 07:30 PM
Guys,

Had another play with the image to fix little errors and omissions.   The only changes are the dot between the w116 and org, plus borders around the blue border and star and bigger screws.  It's not the final precise artwork that will be submitted but it's yet again a bit more representative of the finished product.
Can't upload to gallery otherwise I would've edited my last post, so here's an imageshack link. Click for bigger image.

(http://img169.imageshack.us/my.php?image=finish5medium2xp6.jpg)

Compare the older one
(http://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?image=finishbadgemediumvh9a7acc6.jpg)

Here's gallery link, can't show it directly sorry http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/FINISH5+_Medium_+_2_.jpg.html?g2_enterAlbum=0 (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/FINISH5+_Medium_+_2_.jpg.html?g2_enterAlbum=0)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: James R on 07 March 2007, 01:50 AM
How about using Ebay to collect the orders from us all once price has been confirmed with the supplier ? If you ran that Oscar, I personally would have no trouble in paying in advance.

Thanks to everyone for this by the way.  I might have a 6.9 by the weekend and a badge will look really smart on it.

James

Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 07 March 2007, 06:35 AM
Hi James,

Your last statement is what got my attention ;D ;D

Hi all, an UPDATE!!
SIZE ???  3 inches is maximum but assuming the badge will be more secure between metal horizontal grill moulds, that measurement is 2" 3/8ths.
What's people's thoughts on that??  See pics below for examples.  You may also notice the screw positions seem to land squarely on the grill insert horizontal.  Gee, talk about smooth sailing. So 3" or 2"3/8ths, there may be overlapping on to the metal moulding afterall so screws fit in between the grill.
What's it to be, 3" or 2"3/8ths?  No polls. ;)  Take a ruler to your grills gentlemen.



Here's the latest.  Sent an updated email to www.arniebrown.com , with the above design.  As I said, as good as it looks, it needs to be finalised by an artist to be able to fed into their computerised pattern cutter.  The labour involved is included in the $100US mould making price so we may not have to hassle Andrew116 to convert the badge to the specific file format.  All that is needed is a high res jpeg which they have now.

As far as payments are concerned, it is likely now that Mforcer will take over which I'm very comfortable with.  I'll leave it to him to comment on the how and when but I'd imagine paypal for those outside Australia and maybe bank transfer within Aus.  I've noticed the minimum order has changed now as of 1st March to a minimum of 40 units.  That's a bummer but achievable in my opinion.

4 weeks it takes to make the original master which I'm sure everyone will be waiting with baited breath to see.  Assuming all dues are paid and ready to go, it's another 4 weeks for delivery.  I can't wait ;)  As a teaser to the quality of the workmanship here's an example of what has been done by AB

(http://imageshack.us)


The difference between 3" and 2"&3/8ths

A roughly 2"3/8ths km milestone badge thanks to JohnJ.
(http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mb1000000004mediumii4.jpg)

Relative 3" size
(http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mb10000000042mediumdn7.jpg)

Relative difference between size
(http://imageshack.us)

(http://imageshack.us)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: koan on 07 March 2007, 08:49 AM

I like the small one.

koan
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: OzBenzHead on 07 March 2007, 09:38 AM
Here is a badge that is 73 mm (2.874 015 748 inch) diameter, with a single, centred fixing screw.

Note that because the screw is centred, and there are four segments of grille grid between horizontal bars, that the badge sits slightly below the centre point between the bars - not ideal. The top of the badge is still kept off the grill grid - just - but the eccentricity relative to the horizontals is not aesthetically pleasing.

If we go for a badge that sits on the horizontals rather than on the grille grid itself, the fixing screw/s would need to be above or below the badge centre line.

I care less whether the W116.org badge sits on the grid or on the horizontals - as long as it sits better than the pictured example; otherwise I have no preference for one size over another.

Apologies for the grubby photo - I went out in the rain at 1:30 a.m. to snap it.

Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: gregdeklerk on 07 March 2007, 09:53 AM
If you want the smaller badge to work you will have to position the holes in the same place as the one on the high mileage badge I posted in the "grill badge construction" thread.

I think a few of the members will buy more than one badge, so I would'nt worry about the 40 min.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 07 March 2007, 12:34 PM
How's this for a compromise, extended laurel with screwholes lowered a little to fit in between grill grid. 
Old on the left, new on the right, both are clickable for bigger images.

(http://img169.imageshack.us/my.php?image=finish5medium2xp6.jpg) (http://img337.imageshack.us/my.php?image=finish7ir6.jpg)


Bigger 3" or smaller 2"3/8ths, the screws will fit.
Look at the big and small badge on the right side, forget the other two on the left, I couldn't delete them.


(http://imageshack.us)



As for the big or small debate, here's another example.  I can't make my mind up.  Big badge looks good but it may be too big.  I don't want a pizza plate stuck to my grill ::) Exaggeration I know.  The small one seems much smaller but will fit in between the aluminium strips hence wont mark them.  I got new strips see, so I'm thinking about this aspect.  Like I said, take a metal rule out to your car and measure 3" and 2"3/8ths and keep letting me know.  I'll make scale cutouts and try them tomorrow.

I think we can say the screw hole location has been sorted now.


(http://imageshack.us)


Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: koan on 07 March 2007, 03:58 PM

Why can't the small badge have a single hidden fixing screw in the middle?

koan
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 07 March 2007, 07:30 PM
  (http://img337.imageshack.us/my.php?image=finish7ir6.jpg)

UPDATE:

I've heard back from Arnie Brown ;D
No problems with reproducing our badge in all respects, and in short here's what will be done :
Mike will most likely plate the brass with 22 karat gold and then use a clear coat of epoxy to make it impervious to the elements.

Man this badge is going to look good!!! ;D


Quote from: koan on 07 March 2007, 03:58 PM
Why can't the small badge have a single hidden fixing screw in the middle?

It's ability to rotate would be my bugbear plus it would only be soldered on.  There's been no real objection to two countersunk holes apart from my concerns raised in greg's thread on badge construction (http://forum.w116.org/the-org/grill-badge-construction/0/) .  Personally I'm starting to warm to the idea of the countersunk holes which wont be an issue during manufacture according to AB.



Anymore thoughts on the 3" v's 2"3/8ths issue.  May have to let Mforcer decide.
I printed up two sized badges on cardstock matching the dimensions talked about and tried them on the 280S with blutac.

The 3" isn't as oversize as what I thought it would be.  It's more legible too.  I think foam tape applied to the top and bottom will protect the aluminium strips.

(http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imgp2048mediumks3.jpg) (http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imgp2039mediumpl3.jpg) (http://img219.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imgp2038mediumnu5.jpg) (http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imgp2035ou3.jpg)

(http://imageshack.us) (http://imageshack.us)






Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: OzBenzHead on 07 March 2007, 08:38 PM
Well, after seeing those examples, the larger size is my preference, because it would better complement my other badge (appears to be exactly the same size).  However, I'll settle for whatever's chosen by the final arbiter.

As to the screws (single centred, or double) - again I have no preference, but I must say that in the three years that red badge has been on my 116, it has never budged in any direction, including rotation.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: gregdeklerk on 08 March 2007, 07:47 AM
Oscar, I also think that the bigger badge might look better, but lets see what the others want. Maybe another poll?
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: s class on 08 March 2007, 08:03 AM
Oh come on guys, not another poll? 
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 08 March 2007, 08:23 AM
I was just about to say, I'd rather avoid a poll and was hoping anyone passionate about the size would speak up.  I was for the smaller size but after holding these cutouts and viewing them on the grill, i have to say the 3" badge looks more attractive and I retract the pizza plate reference I made on the other page :)

Looking at some photos of cars with club badges and so forth, some appear to touch and rest on the metal strips, ie they're about 3" in size.  There's some smaller ones too but I'm all for the 3" size after trying both sizes on the car today.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Martin 280s on 08 March 2007, 10:35 AM
I think if the badge fits between the strips rather than over them it certainly would be more professional looking.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: James R on 08 March 2007, 03:37 PM
I agree with my Brazilian colleague. Smaller is best. (Stop it)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Martin 280s on 08 March 2007, 03:45 PM
Quote from: James R on 08 March 2007, 03:37 PM
I agree with my Brazilian colleague. Smaller is best. (Stop it)

James, Hate to tell you but I'm a fake Brazilian...born and bred in the north of England!

P.S. My middle name is also James! A friend of my mum's once had an Irish Wolfhound called James, too.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: gregdeklerk on 09 March 2007, 12:43 AM
Oscar, just a question: Will the manufacturer ship the badges directly to those who have placed orders? It seems simpler this way then you don't have to send them out!

Martin: I see that silly Bush is in your neck of the woods for a visit!! They closed a whole lot of roads in SP!!
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 09 March 2007, 01:42 AM
Hi greg; mforcer is likely to take on shipping and payment details from here on in.  I did ask the manufacturer originally about sending some badges individually.  I didn't really get a difinitive response on that.  I'd assume they'd like to put all the badges in one box but it does seem pointless of sending badges back to the US for example.

I believe mforcer is away for a few days.  So I wont speculate atm on how the ordering, payment and shipping process will eventuate. When he gets back hopefully more details will follow some time after.  Meantime, we'll sort the size issue out and I want to fix the dimples before a the mould is made.  Sometime soon hopefully a "hands up who wants in" will be posted.   :)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: James R on 09 March 2007, 04:59 PM
Well Martin, although you're a confirmed Notherner, I shall forgive you because you have so much James history !

James

PS...Bush in the woods ? Isn't that where they're supposed to be ?
PPS...I want my badge. NOW !
PPPS..Just kidding !
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: macatron on 09 March 2007, 06:25 PM
As for the mounting method, I will be happy with whatever is decided.

However, I do prefer the larger size as the two I currently have (M-B Club of America and my 250,000 km award) are both 3" in diameter.  I'd hate for this one to be dwarfed by the other two!

Incidentally, I'm looking forward to 2008.  Bush will be out of the White House and the new C Class will be at the dealerships.   ;D




Edit - I'll see about posting a picture of my grille and badges tonight for everyone's reference for size.
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 10 March 2007, 10:06 AM
Thought I'd share the latest image with you all.  Here's the gallery link  (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/w116orgbadge.jpg.html?g2_enterAlbum=0#) if your on a work computer and can't view imageshack pics

I'm finished fiddling with it.  Basically it's had the dimples rearranged so they're concentric circles unlike previous examples that appeared off centre and spiral like.
Realigned text which was off and had to redraw star. 

That's about it.  The pedantic like myself will see little rough edges but all will be smoothed out by the badgemaker artist.  Ooh and macatron, do please show us your other badges.  Cheers.




(http://imageshack.us)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: macatron on 10 March 2007, 01:53 PM
Well, I can no longer hide the fact that my car isn't perfect up close!  But, here are the badges I do have for everyone's reference.

(http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=grillebadge2je7.jpg)

The high-mileage award would be smaller but for the fact that the milage designation sticks below.  Top to bottom, the whole badge is essentially 3 inches.
(http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=grillebadge3br2.jpg)

Here, you can see that I put some fender washers behind the badge and in front of the grille itself.  The reason I did this is because the high-mileage badge is just big enough to rest on only one of the aluminum grille strips.  This means that it would have been angled either up or down.  With the washers, it rests flat on the grille and doesn't touch the aluminum strips at all.  I put threadlocker on the nuts so I didn't have to tighten anything enough to risk cracking the plastic.
(http://img65.imageshack.us/my.php?image=grillebadge4xt3.jpg)

Both badges have two studs that protrude through the grille and bolt up in different ways.  Thread locker keeps everything secure.
(http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=grillebadge5hp0.jpg)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 10 March 2007, 06:21 PM
http://forum.w116.org/the-org/final-poll-grill-badge/30/ (http://forum.w116.org/the-org/final-poll-grill-badge/30/)

maca, that spacer idea is a top idea as is the thread locker.

Your car looks really nice btw.  Not all US 5mph bumpers have a chrome top I think? Looks much better. I see you got a bit off pinstripping too! ;D
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: Martin 280s on 12 March 2007, 05:33 AM
Quote from: gregdeklerk on 09 March 2007, 12:43 AM
Oscar, just a question: Will the manufacturer ship the badges directly to those who have placed orders? It seems simpler this way then you don't have to send them out!

Martin: I see that silly Bush is in your neck of the woods for a visit!! They closed a whole lot of roads in SP!!

Thankfully he's buggered off to torment some other South American country! The Brazilian President is also a fool so imagine Bush and Lula together, more like a situation comedy than political meeting....Bush doesn't speak Portuguese and Lula doesn't speak English, well for that matter he doesn't even speak Portuguese correctly!!!! ::) ::)
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: James R on 12 March 2007, 11:41 AM
Where are we with this ? Are we waiting for the manufacturer to come back to us ? I can't remember. Do we put our hands up yet ?

James
Title: Re: FINAL POLL: Grill Badge
Post by: oscar on 12 March 2007, 05:45 PM
I was just posting Mforcer when you pipped in front of me.

Here's the badge that was submitted yesterday

click here (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/Ford_20logo_20weiss800.jpg.html?g2_enterAlbum=0)

;D ;D

Ok, here it is.  Seriously!

click here (http://gallery.w116.org/v/garage/oscars/grill+badge/w116orggrillebadge+_Medium_.jpg.html)

As for the rest, do as Mforcer says.