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Garage => Test Drive => Topic started by: Brian Crump on 01 January 2008, 10:37 PM

Title: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Brian Crump on 01 January 2008, 10:37 PM
Why is a 6.9 waterpump so expensive? I am told that the last one currently in stock in Australia was sold this week for approx. $3500.00. This is making R-R ownership cheap!!!!
Regards,
BC
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Bandolero on 02 January 2008, 12:06 AM
Because the MB spare parts people who make the price decisions in Germany are A**holes.
Also, the dealers want to make top profit.
I was quoted AU$4850 plus GST at the dealership, so you were quoted a discounted price.
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: 116Benz on 02 January 2008, 12:27 AM
And people wonder why places like Autohausaz do such good business shipping stuff over here. For the life of me I can't think why. ::)
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Big_Richard on 02 January 2008, 03:01 AM
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Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: CraigS on 02 January 2008, 03:04 AM
Because it is unique to the 6.9 (and the early ones will also fit the 6.3). They can be reconditioned as someone has mentioned, and I have mine done at a company in Melbourne for around $300.
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Des on 02 January 2008, 03:21 AM
I know it has been mentioned they are "different" to other MB's but is there anything special about them? any magic or trickery, I'd imagine they have to pump a lot of water, like the oil and oil filter I am guessing they are quite large compared to other cars?

Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Wolfgang Germany on 02 January 2008, 07:30 AM
Quote from: BC on 01 January 2008, 10:37 PM
Why is a 6.9 waterpump so expensive? I am told that the last one currently in stock in Australia was sold this week for approx. $3500.00. This is making R-R ownership cheap!!!!
Regards,
BC


§3500,- really?? From a MB-dealer?  :o

Since this year the 6.9 waterpump (A 100 200 3201/80) costs 517,-Eur (without 19% tax) in Germany. Till 31.12.07 the pump has cost 387,90 Eur (without 19% tax). The price includes the change with the old part.

By the way, it´s normal that the prices increase. MB would like to minimize their high costs for storage. The last two years MB sell the most of their (intersting) old parts for W110 up to W124 to the mb-clubs with al lower price. The rest was scrapped by MB! This included really rare parts for example Interieur stuff, motorparts or chasisparts. That´s the way of business!

Here is a link to the german MB-club VDH, which became a lot of parts.

VDH-Mercedesclubs (http://www.mercedesclubs.de/neuteileliste/index.html)
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: 116Benz on 02 January 2008, 07:37 AM
Scrapped? I suppose it was inevitable, but what about if one of those scapped parts became a needed item again, do they make provision for someone to make more? Or do we scour ebay in hope that another one turns up?
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Wolfgang Germany on 02 January 2008, 08:20 AM
Quote from: 116Benz on 02 January 2008, 07:37 AM
Scrapped? I suppose it was inevitable, but what about if one of those scapped parts became a needed item again, do they make provision for someone to make more? Or do we scour ebay in hope that another one turns up?

If there are enough people who need a part, mb will produce this part. But it must be a lot of people, do you understand?  ::)
For example the 15" alloy wheel (W108/W116 barock design) was reproduced by MB in 2005. But this was a tough and long process from people out of the club to convince MB.

In the future the VDH (which cooperate with MB) will be a good source for old parts. And of course ebay.
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: 116Benz on 02 January 2008, 08:44 AM
At least theres a backup supply if it gets difficult..
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: nathan on 02 January 2008, 09:20 AM
i agree with bandalero, you got a discount!
i got suckered and bought the 500 dollar repair kit which strangely doesnt include all the (bearings?) stuff one need to refurbish the pump...what a gip!
wait till you ask about a starter too!
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Brian Crump on 02 January 2008, 04:25 PM
Gentlemen,
The intent of this question was to ask what is so special about the 6.9 waterpump that means it is 10 times the price of the 450SE pump. I am interested in knowing if it is so different that the cost is warranted.
Please do not take my question as a complaint against anyone for costs and please do not read into this thread anything other than the original question.
Regards,
BC
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Wolfgang Germany on 02 January 2008, 05:09 PM
Quote from: BC on 02 January 2008, 04:25 PM
Gentlemen,
The intent of this question was to ask what is so special about the 6.9 waterpump that means it is 10 times the price of the 450SE pump. I am interested in knowing if it is so different that the cost is warranted.
Please do not take my question as a complaint against anyone for costs and please do not read into this thread anything other than the original question.
Regards,
BC

I think it´s only the demand. For a car what was built only 7.380 times (450SEL->101.182) you don´t often need a waterpump.
So the costs for storage are huge. And that´s is the reason while the price year for year will increase. This part is causing costs.
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: CraigS on 03 January 2008, 01:00 AM
I agree with Wolfgang. As mentioned, with only 7380 units produced (and 6526 6.3's and 2677 600's), it is failrly easy to see how the costs could be excessive. For example, one single fuel injector for a 6.3/600 costs in excess of US $1800, or A$16,500 per set !
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: 116Benz on 03 January 2008, 05:57 AM
When you put it into perspective like that, yes it makes sense. Thing is, what about the likes of 600's? did they have the same problem? They were in production till 1980, and shared alot of the same stuff with 6.3's

Imagine if it was the same problem only a water pump for an M110..that thought makes me shudder... ::)
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Brian Crump on 03 January 2008, 09:59 PM
Well here's an interesing twist on spare parts. The local dealer had a 600 in before xmas - 17,000 ks and ex-consular. It required seals, hoses, brakes etc as it had stood with very little use. That's to be expected. What came as a surprise to the Service Manager was the odd rumble it developed over about 70kmph. It turned out to be that all four wheels had gone out of round because the car had sat stationary for so long and the weight of the car distorted the wheels. Well, the wheels were available ex-Germany at $10,000 a set. Moral of the story? Buy one that has seen a few high speed chases in its life.  ;D
Regards,
BC
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: CraigS on 04 January 2008, 02:16 AM
Not still under warranty with that mileage ? They are only a 15" wheel, so I would imagine that any 6.5" wide MB rim would work OK.
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: s class on 04 January 2008, 02:28 AM
Craig apparently the stud spacing is unique to the 600. 
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: CraigS on 04 January 2008, 02:31 AM
Not sure about that one, but the alternative if it is would be to take out the centre of the old rims and weld them into new rims. Shouldn't be that complicated for a good engineer, and a lot less expensive than $10,000 - there are also plenty of wrecks around the world, so anyone paying that price would have to be mental.
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: Brian Crump on 04 January 2008, 03:35 AM
Quote from: CraigS on 04 January 2008, 02:16 AM
Not still under warranty with that mileage ? They are only a 15" wheel, so I would imagine that any 6.5" wide MB rim would work OK.
Probably not - I meant an M-100 type 600. It also lead the Service Manager (whom I know well through Miss Olga) to comment that the 6.3 is a real motor, and, in his opinion the 6.9 is a truck motor.  :o
Regards,
BC
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: CraigS on 04 January 2008, 03:58 AM
Brian - it was a tongue in cheek comment, and yes, I did realise you were talking about the W100. The 6.3 and 6.9 motors use the same block, so it's bit of a strange comment. The only change was to dry sump lubrication and hydraulic valve adjustment. If you saw them both out of the car, they both look like truck motors.
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: johnnyw116 on 28 January 2008, 03:40 PM
hi today my friend came to me with his 6.9 i sold to him some time ago , and his water pump is leaking verry hard , today i took the pump of the engine ( was easyer than i thought ) and now i go looking for a new pump , verry interesting what it gonna cost me ??? 

Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: CraigS on 28 January 2008, 04:03 PM
This is the benchmark price

http://www.autohausaz.com/search/product.aspx?sid=gbdnp2fzvgjhvg3moajvdpuk&makeid=800016@Mercedes&modelid=1367603@450SEL&year=1979&cid=16@Cooling%20System&gid=2208@Water%20Pump

and another alternative

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/RARE-MERCEDES-6-9-WATER-PUMP-450SEL-REBUILT-1975-80-NR_W0QQitemZ230215902536QQihZ013QQcategoryZ34202QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: johnnyw116 on 29 January 2008, 01:40 PM
hi i found an original Mercedes 6.9 waterpump for about 500 euro and i must turn in the old waterpump and its deliverd within 24 hours 
www.kostwinderverhoeven.nl
better expensive than not for sale i always say  ;)
my 280SE waterpump was a lot cheaper 40 euro  :D   

greetings : johnny  .           
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: WGB on 29 January 2008, 09:03 PM
Quote from: BC on 04 January 2008, 03:35 AM
Probably not - I meant an M-100 type 600. It also lead the Service Manager (whom I know well through Miss Olga) to comment that the 6.3 is a real motor, and, in his opinion the 6.9 is a truck motor.  :o
Regards,
BC

It's an interesting point that the 6.9 always seems to be the underdog in the M100 "Club".

I guess it is up to us to make sure that our 6.9's are up to the standard of some of the well sorted "older" models and then just wait.

I think our age group is a little younger on average than the 6.3/600 so time is on our side.

Maybe it's just that the 6.9 was better sorted from the beginning and doesn't pose the same challenge as the older cars.

Bill
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: 450SEL69 on 31 January 2008, 08:12 AM
Quote from: s class on 04 January 2008, 02:28 AM
Craig apparently the stud spacing is unique to the 600. 

Incorrect, 600 wheels have period stud spacing and offset to suit other models from this period, I met a guy in Germany who had a 6.9 with 15" 600 hubs and wheels fitted.

Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: scraf on 01 February 2008, 02:25 PM
Quote from: BC on 03 January 2008, 09:59 PM
It turned out to be that all four wheels had gone out of round because the car had sat stationary for so long and the weight of the car distorted the wheels.

Not the tyres?
Title: Re: Why is a 6.9 water pump so expensive?
Post by: CraigS on 01 February 2008, 03:04 PM
No, apparently it was the actual wheels.