News:

www.W116.org - The #1 resource for our W116! Established 2004

Main Menu

What amazing cars . . . .

Started by raueda1, 27 July 2018, 07:52 PM

raueda1

. . . these W116's are.  And since mine is a 6.9 I'll lavish my highest praise on that.  After a lot of replacing, repairing and tuning I think I really am close to the end of the fiddling and the beginning of having a great driver.  Apart from the cruise control everything now really does seem to work, and work well. 

I just drove from Salt Lake City on a hairpin turn mountain road over a 3000m pass and down to Park City.  Had a fine beer there at the Wasatch Brewpub, looked at the girls and headed back on the interstate.  It has another pass at 2170m.  This circle route, maybe 35 miles, is perfect for sorting out how well things are sorted out.  It just reaffirmed that these cars are really quite remarkable. 

First, there's the suspension.  It was completely untroubled by the lousy, frost-heaved, potholed, twist mountain road.  You can hear the potholes thump a little but not really feel them.  How it can stay as smooth as it does is one life's mysteries.  No problems there, thank you Citroen and MB.  The speed limit was really imposed only by tiny radius hairpin turns.  The more you drive these cars the more addictive the suspension becomes.  It makes the current fashion of getting "performance handling" from stiff-no-roll springing and ultra low profile tires seem kind of crude in an odd way. There was also no sign of overheating despite 95°F temperatures, no knocking or pinging, no valve seal smoking going down 12% grades, no problems at all.  Idle is now very smooth and shifting is great after recent rebuild.  Nevertheless, I may advance the timing a tiny bit more to see if there's anything more to be squeezed out of her.

On the ride back a guy rudely passed me on the highway in a fancy 740i with blacked out windows and fancy wheels/tires.  You all know the type.  I punished him for his impertinence by passing him, letting him pass me and then passing him again.  He didn't stand a chance.  I trust he was suitably humiliated and is now shopping for a 6.9.  This would not have been possible without the help and support of this group. Thanks again and keep on rolling!  Cheers,
-Dave
Now:  1976 6.9 Euro, 2015 GL550
Before that:  1966 230S, 1964 220SE coupe, 1977 Carrera 3.0

Diesel 617

That last part about passing gave me a good laugh.

Even in a worn out 280k mile 300SD, it still rides smoother than nearly all of the modern cars I have rode in. I have to keep in mind this was a 100k car when it was sold and it reflects that fact after much time and use has passed. Remarkable way ahead of it's time engineering and design. People think I am crazy for wanting to keep the w116. I tell them you have to drive it to understand, it's something you have to experience. I could only imagine how a rebuilt 6.9 rides and drives.
X3 1980 300SD Blown Heads, trans -Retired
1980 450SEL Parted out/Scrap
1980 450SEL to Diesel Parted Out/Scrap
1979 280SE Euro Spec Cloth Seats Sold
1979 300CD Daily Driver - Sold


Inventory of w116 Parts
[url="https://www.ebay.com/usr/vintagepartsandstuff"]https://www.ebay.com/usr/vintagepartsandstuff[/url]

Squiggle Dog

Ah, Parley's canyon! I've been on that road in my W116 as well. I actually had a 1968 W110 200D up that canyon when I was making a trip from Washington to visit family years ago. The car did great on the entire trip, but when I was 3/4 of the way up the grade, the engine slowed down considerably, got hot, and started smoking black. That darn altitude! Hills were no problem earlier in the trip.

That's actually a pretty good stretch of road for testing a vehicle's performance and endurance. When I was younger, my mother used to drive us through that canyon to visit relatives in Salt Lake City, and our 1994 Ford Aerostar van could barely do 40 MPH up the grade.

Oh, and you know that steep grade going up from Heber to Park City past Jordanelle dam? Even my V8-powered 1950s American cars struggled to keep speed up that hill. But, my first W116, a $300 1980 300SD, hauled butt up that hill and didn't slow down a bit. I couldn't believe how much climbing power Mercedes got out of the smallest engine in their W116 fleet. And you've got three more cylinders to work with!

I'll hopefully be headed up to Utah in three weeks... I'm running low on time to get my car put back together with all these delays. The pressure is on!
Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+

ptashek

The W116 are amazing cars indeed. Good performance that kicks butt of almost anything else made at the time, easy enough to work on, problem free if well maintained, and a joy to drive on any distance. They do turn heads too, young and old. Combined with a V6 or V8 W124 in the stable, they do make a perfect pair :D
1993 "Pearl Blue" W124 280TE
1988 "Arctic White" W124 200T
1979 "Icon Gold" W116 450SE

TJ 450

Excellent, it sounds like the trip went well.

They are great cars on the open road, I went on a 500km return trip yesterday in my blue 6.9 to clear out the cobwebs.

How do you find cornering at speed on undulating surfaces? From what i've Experienced and heard, the hydro cars have an odd characteristic. I'm sure any 6.9 owners will know what I'm talking about. To the uninitiated it can be quite unnerving indeed.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500

raueda1

Quote from: TJ 450 on 28 July 2018, 11:18 PM
Excellent, it sounds like the trip went well.  They are great cars on the open road, I went on a 500km return trip yesterday in my blue 6.9 to clear out the cobwebs.

How do you find cornering at speed on undulating surfaces? From what i've Experienced and heard, the hydro cars have an odd characteristic. I'm sure any 6.9 owners will know what I'm talking about. To the uninitiated it can be quite unnerving indeed.

Tim
Hmmm, I'm not entirely sure, haven't paid too much attention and I'm not sure how much I've experienced cornering at speed on undulating surfaces.  The mountain roads mentioned above are generally without guard rails, narrow and with precipitous drops off the edge.  Hard cornering is something done at 20mph and sliding off the road would really be the end.  Now I'm curious about that!  I'm going to find a place where I can see what happens.  Maybe I'll stick a GoPro on the hood and find a suitable mountain drive.   ;D
-Dave
Now:  1976 6.9 Euro, 2015 GL550
Before that:  1966 230S, 1964 220SE coupe, 1977 Carrera 3.0

daantjie

I too have read that at the time some car testers observed an unnerving diagonal type chassis movement under certain cornering maneuvres. Maybe it has to do with the fact that the front axle and rear axle have to somewhat "catch up" during rapid changes in road surface and weight transfer ????
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

raueda1

Quote from: daantjie on 29 July 2018, 02:43 PM
I too have read that at the time some car testers observed an unnerving diagonal type chassis movement under certain cornering maneuvres. Maybe it has to do with the fact that the front axle and rear axle have to somewhat "catch up" during rapid changes in road surface and weight transfer ????
My Suburban does something like that going too fast on bad surfaces.  It feels like the car is slipping sideways in little lurches.  Similar phenomenon?  It would be pretty hilarious for a 6.9 and Suburban to have a similar handling flaw.   ::)
-Dave
Now:  1976 6.9 Euro, 2015 GL550
Before that:  1966 230S, 1964 220SE coupe, 1977 Carrera 3.0

TJ 450

Yes it is the diagonal movement, and I have since replaced the front and rear suspension bushings, ball joints, upper control arms etc. the only original parts are the struts and upper strut mounts.

I'm pretty sure they all do it to be honest although it's made much worse by spheres that have lost their charge.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500

raueda1

Quote from: TJ 450 on 30 July 2018, 12:53 AM
Yes it is the diagonal movement, and I have since replaced the front and rear suspension bushings, ball joints, upper control arms etc. the only original parts are the struts and upper strut mounts.

I'm pretty sure they all do it to be honest although it's made much worse by spheres that have lost their charge.

Tim
Thanks for that.  I'm going to try to find someplace I can experiment where poor performance doesn't send me off a cliff.  In the case of the Suburban the crabbing occurs especially on a slightly washboard surface over a certain speed.  I've experienced this countless times offroad (or bad roads) It's like the suspension elements can't respond quickly enough to go all the way down in the dips. That causes a kind of shuddering and sideways crabbing.  It can happen quite abruptly - Whoa, slow down a little!  It's a direct function of speed, spacing and depth of the washboard ridges across the road.  Obviously I'm not driving the 6.9 on roads like that but I can imagine a similar phenomenon on paved surfaces too.
-Dave
Now:  1976 6.9 Euro, 2015 GL550
Before that:  1966 230S, 1964 220SE coupe, 1977 Carrera 3.0

TJ 450

Interestingly enough, it performs well over washboard or corrugated surfaces, in fact the 6.9 does well here. It's when there are dips and low frequency undulations the get the car bouncing around when the problems arise. I'll see if I can find a pic of an example.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500


daantjie

My theory is it is because of the fact that the front and respectively the rear wheels are connected, suspension wise, by way of the sway bar of course but also the wheels have a hydraulic circuit "binding" them together by way of one of the "B" lines and leveling valve of course.  I would have to go and study the manual (again:)) but I am pretty sure there is a "T" piece connecting the front and rear wheels respectively, might be the B5 line, not sure from memory. Thus my theory is that the yawing motion we are talking about is exacerbated by the front and back of the car moving through a dip or rise "independently" so to speak.  Seeing further that the car is turning as well (not pointing with wheels straight ahead whilst experiencing this motion) it translates into a "diagonal" sensation.  Sorry maybe I am way off base in my amateur engineering study here but at least to me it makes sense ;D  The faster you go the harder it will be for the front and rear to "catch up" and I suspect this diagonal motion might even become quite violent and cause the back end to snap out on you, making for some "interesting" maneuvring...
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

Harv

I truly love my W116. When I drive down the road at 55mph, it feels so damn good. Nothing is shaking, nothing is rattling, nothing. Just the hum from the diesel engine. I own a W123 too and it doesn't compare. The W123 is a good car, but the 116 is just better at everything except the stupid climate control. For the money I paid for my 116, I don't think I'll ever have a reason to sell it. It's that good.
1980 300SD
1983 240D
2000 E55 AMG
2002 G500