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Garage => Test Drive => Topic started by: Des on 11 October 2007, 02:00 AM

Title: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 02:00 AM
Patrick among others in the past has made reference to the ridiculous prices Mercedes Benz seem to expect for their parts.

Was chatting today to a forum member, we were talking about the $500 AU new price Mercedes want for 1 single, solitary hubcap, unpainted.

Just makes you shake your head in disgust really.

Yes I am an ambassador to Mercedes excellent supply of parts for cars going back decades, but, and its a BIG but they need to be reasonably priced.

yes I don't expect a new hubcap for $20, $200? maybe, $500 odd, when you add that up for 4 is 2 grand.
more than what many of our vintage W123', W116's would bring on the market.


just a little rant,

 :(
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 02:11 AM
I would like to hear from other members......

"What is the most ridiculous price you have ever been given from a Mercedes Benz dealer, for a part?"



I remember being quoted over $3,000 AU for a new dash for a 6.9
Brand new mirror for a W123, Left Hand side, $1100AU, picked up a good used one from John Green for $120


anyone else?

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 11 October 2007, 02:13 AM
And a valid rant Des ! I understand that they, and any manufacturer wants a return on their investment, and I have no argument with that, but what I don't understand is the variation in prices between countries. We all know that the US market is subsidised by MB, or should that be Daimler, but why or how, can a part be priced in Australia at more than 100% of the US price ? Sure, it is a smaller market, with a slower moving inventory, and that needs to be financed, but more than 100% ? These after market sellers in the US are still making a margin, otherwise they wouldn't be in the business, so who is claiming the high margins in Australia ? I'm sure the reseller is making a pretty fair margin, but that doesn't explain the variation.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 02:22 AM
Craig, there has been very little, in the way of W123/W116 parts that I have bought, other than oil filters that have actually been in stock in Australia, everything has to come from Germany, with 1 week postage delay.

hoses, clamps, trim, trim clips, engine mounts,
In the last 3 months I have spent over $6k in parts for a W123, chrome strips, window moldings, seals, gaskets, clips, tail lights, engine mounts, etc.. etc...
all coming from Germany
So really, to a simple man like me the price should be the same as if I was in Germany, plus a little postage and packing.

In fact the postage wasn't that bad, all these goodies came in a big box, nearly the size of the inside space of a W123 boot, about 30kg's for $90 AU postage from Germany.

I'm sure Craig with your 300, you could also list a long list of parts that are a small goldmine from MB that you have had to purchase.




Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Big_Richard on 11 October 2007, 02:25 AM
I think the moral of the story is - don't buy a Mercedes if you cant afford to pay for the parts. Theres no point whinging and whining about the price of the parts, there are plenty of other manufacturers to choose from if you don't like the spare parts prices.


Ive spent over a grand on switch's and other miscellaneous crap for my centre console, and i don't give a shit - I don't drink, i don't smoke and i don't take drugs. Yet, i get lectured from a chain smoker for wasting my money - yeah, that makes sense  ::)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 02:31 AM
Patrick, I'm not having a cry over a $30 Mercedes oil filter, or a 100 odd dollar tie rod end.

its not entirely about affording the parts, hubcaps are not a necessity to keep a car going, its just about making it look nice. Restoration.

Yes I could afford to buy them tomorrow if I "had" to have them, but you have to look and wonder sometimes.




Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: nathan on 11 October 2007, 02:34 AM
touche PB, touche!  i use that argument quite a bit too - doesnt seem to work though...
however, i sitll like to bitch...
i think the crappy thing is is that having our old 116s on the road is advertising for the longevity of such cars and pricing them off the road isnt in the interest of the company...craig put it well re inflation versus other countries...although the guys at MB here in parts in perth are great bunch (ok, not all, but the ones i know!), theres a reason dad gets his shit sent from singapore for a fraction of the price...bill put it into perspective with the spheres, 5x 740 bucks vs 5x under 200 bucks from singapore...
at the end of the day, its all money making and benz au must make enough dough not to need used parts as a contributor to their income
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 02:38 AM
Nathan, does Mercedes have some sort of parts stockpile in singapore?

I thought if it wasn't in stock in Australia it had to come from Mercedesland  Germany?

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Big_Richard on 11 October 2007, 02:47 AM
Patrick, I'm not having a cry over a $30 Mercedes oil filter, or a 100 odd dollar tie rod end.

its not entirely about affording the parts, hubcaps are not a necessity to keep a car going, its just about making it look nice. Restoration.

Yes I could afford to buy them tomorrow if I "had" to have them, but you have to look and wonder sometimes.

I learned a long time ago, buying anything in Australia is a rip off - and that still hasn't changed to this day. Oil filters are ten bucks, complete tie rods (not just the ends) are about 40 bucks.. Buy in AU and you *will* pay thru the nose, convenience comes at a price.

I only buy in AU at the dealers what i absolutely CANT buy anywhere else. Some of the second hand prices thrown around on this board come close to what you can buy new for, if only people did a little research and were able to wait a while for parts to arrive...
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 11 October 2007, 02:53 AM
There is a central warehouse in Singapore. Stocks come from wherever they can get them from. In some cases it will be Singapore, other times Germany.

The question of price is not about whether you can afford it. It is about whether you feel you are getting ripped off and what the philosophy of the company is in terms of their pricing. I suspect that, US aside, they look at each country individually and determine what margin to apply. Some of the prices that Ryan has quoted are on a par with the US, yet that same part in Australia is considerably more. I suspect that prices here in Turkey will also be high, solely because they think would be that if you can afford a Mercedes, you can afford the parts, otherwise you would be driving a Dogan.

The US is a unique market in as much as it is the biggest market for MB outside of Germany, and it is subsidised to a fairly high degree to maintain the high presence there, but that does not mean that we should be penalised for living in a medium income country as compared to the less affluent.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 02:54 AM
do you buy online PB?

can you share your buying secrets with us?

As I am sure I am not the only one that would appreciate the info and benefit

 :) Des
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: nim205 on 11 October 2007, 03:15 AM
In the car industry, pricing is rarely related to the actual production cost, but rather to what the retailer thinks the market will pay. That is why the exact same OEM part will cost one price if it is sold as an original Mercedes part, a lower price if it sold as an original Ford (for example) part, and an even lower price if it is sold as a replacement generic part.

Retailer location is another issue. Taxation varies in different places, and can affect the final price considerably. When I owned my previous 116, I lived in Jerusalem. I could get the same part for 100% at the Israeli Mercedes dealership, 50% in eastern Jerusalem, and 10% in Bethlehem, all within a 20 KM radius!

The $500AU hubcap, made me smile. I was looking for a set recently, and was given a phone # of a supplier in the Palestinian authority. He wanted 150 Shekels ( about 37 USD) for an unpainted set of four...
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 11 October 2007, 03:19 AM
You might have to start a parts store ! There is one guy in Lebanon that also sells parts at reasonable prices.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Martin 280s on 11 October 2007, 03:22 AM
I think the worst rip off was being asked R$900.00 for an air filter. To put this into perspective, I paid a fraction more for a set of Goodyear tyres! Eventually I paid R$150 for the filter...still a rip off when nationally made oil filters cost R$16!
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 03:27 AM
Interesting comments, what would be nice is if Mercedes had a loyalty card, or used the Mercedes Benz club card as a loyalty system, so that the more parts you buy the better the discount you get.
I know parts are discounted like 10% with the card from the Classic Center, but I'm talking about every dealer should have to accept it like a VISA card.

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 11 October 2007, 03:30 AM
I guess the question is why would they offer one ? They can sell the parts anyway, so why discount them. The Classic Centre is a little different because they are selling at grossly inflated prices to genuine restorers or enthusiasts, and in either case, they will pay the money, irrespective of the cost, so to give a 15% discount (not 10%) costs them nothing.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 03:33 AM
....well surely logic would dictate that you would sell more hubcaps at $200 a piece than say $500

I don't know!

It just makes me think there is shelves and shelves of parts somewhere that are never going to be sold because they are too overpriced and will probably end up in a landfill before then end up on some people's Benzes.

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 11 October 2007, 03:49 AM
Unfortunately, I don't think logic comes into too many businesses. If you want to buy hubcaps, you will buy them. You can't get them from anyone else. If you are the type of person who wants their car to look as good as you can make it, then you will soend the money. Those that don't care, won't, and I don't think discounting the price is going to persuade those that don't care, to rush out and buy a set.

I had the same discussion here with the company that runs the catering concesssion at the airport. They charge 10 Lira (almost A$10) for a 500ml beer, which is grossly inflated compared to a bar, which will charge 4 Lira. My argument was that if they made it 6 Lira, all of those people that would hesitiate at 10 Lira, would probably buy at 6 Lira, and hence they would have a higher volume of sales, which in turn would increase their profit. What did they do ? They increased the price !
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: SELfor50 on 11 October 2007, 04:25 AM
The hubcap prices are fukn ri-cock-ulous!!!  >:(

I get well worked up by the fact that anytime i've asked for a quote on items (in australia) I get the standard answer of monstrous amounts of $$$.
Just cause I drive a merc, don't mean i'm fukn loaded..."i'm a conservationist". EDIT: (Meant to quote this from OBH, thanks mate good line! ;)  )

BUuuuuuut.....  Before i got the merc, i never knew a fukn thing about cars except where the dip-stick was and how to put petrol in.
And to be honest, the best thing that's ever happened to me was being over-charged for stuff.
It made me learn how the hell to work on my own car and 'extend my trade' as my father says.

PB, valid point!! I smoke, and occasionally drink.  But i've also had people tell me to stop wasting money on cars cause they don't make a return...this coming from someone who insists on spending HUNDREDS of $$$ on a monthly basis to keep their PC up to date for (and buying) the latest games.  Computer technology devalues even quicker than cars.

Overall, I don't put a price on enjoyment... if spending money on a car makes you happy..
Who gives a fuck what anyone else thinks.

$500 for 1 hubcap is STILL FUCKED UP THOUGH!!!
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: oscar on 11 October 2007, 04:27 AM
All prices in AUD
Re hubcaps: about 4yrs ago I was locally quoted $25 used, $50 new unpainted.  Surely they couldn't have inflated 10 fold in that time. 

But the most ridiculous prices I've been quoted have not been from dealers or MB independants.  For the following items that is, local parts stores wanted $400 for a blue bosch coil, $55 for Febi suspension fluid per litre, $360 for bosch ignition leads and $50 for a ryco brand inferior oil filter
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: koan on 11 October 2007, 04:54 AM

I don't know about the rest of the world but in AUS I think we are being ripped off blind.

Ten years ago parts prices were very reasonable even from a dealer. I bought complete tie rods for about $70, cheaper than for the Ford I had at the time which were about $110. Same with headlamp lenses, Mercedes-Benz around $200, can't recall exactly, Ford was over $300.

But things have changed, the pricing on spheres discussed recently elsewhere is an example, I reckon prices have doubled in the last 2 or 3 years.

Some things like exhaust components were always a bit over the top though.

I don't know if the prices we pay for 116 parts is typical of the prices asked for more recent vehicle parts.

I don't mind paying a bit over the odds for consumables like filters and the like, nor do I mind waiting a few weeks for parts from Germany (I've never been asked to cover post charges BTW) as long as I can get them. I'm starting to have doubts about the notion that everything is available for every model for ever, I'm hearing NLA - No Longer Available more and more.

Is it possible that the stock of 116 parts has been transferred to the classic center and they now charge like wounded bulls?

koan
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: nathan on 11 October 2007, 05:35 AM
best inflation ever?
ive mentioned this one before
i bought the 2 new metal wires for the front emergency 6.9 rubber blocks in 02 for about 15 dollars each...cant find my receipt at present...when iwanted some more for goldy this year, quoted 270 dollars...yes, 270 dollars - each...hmmm...maybe they started using gold to forge the cable out of

(http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s211/nathan116/blockbagsv.jpg)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: 116Benz on 11 October 2007, 06:47 AM
My biggest bitch about parts prices is that I never get a phone call back, the local Benz guys used to be brilliant, if I needed anything, I made a call, got the price, handed over the card number and 3 days later I had the parts. Now I ring Canberra or shop at Autohausaz, adsitco or performanceparts and ebay, even emailing Styria for some parts. The longest I have to wait is a week, the sad part is only one of those places is in Australia. As much as there are those out there that will spend bottomless pits of money on their cars, thats their choice I have no opinion on that at all. Some of us, however will go for the best deal possible wether it means supporting the locals or not.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: TJ 450 on 11 October 2007, 07:40 AM
I was quoted $1000 AUD for the front left brake caliper from "a local dealer", although the lining for the timing chain tensioner slide was ~$25 or so.
Last weekend I purchased 3L of hydro oil @ $50/L. I thought the brake caliper was somewhat expensive, although I was happy to fork out $150 for the hydro fluid... it's satisfying to know I have the correct fluid in there  ;)
I have been getting a lot of parts from autohausaz.com, which is excellent, I reckon. The price difference is huge (although a lot of the parts are OEM of course)!
Interestingly, my Dad was quoted ~$300 per Taillight lens for his 107 SL in 1999, I bet they are at least twice the price now!

Tim
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: s class on 11 October 2007, 01:24 PM
I have found Mercedes South Africa's pricing to seem quite fair.  Often expensive, yes, but fair.  I chose to buy my struts here because their price was the same as if I bought from Niemoeller plus postage plus taxes.  Spheres on the other hand I got from Autohaus for about half what the dealer wants.  But that is generally unusual.  90% of my spares come from the main dealer here.

I would be considered one of the top private customers at the main dealer here, accordingly I enquired if I could qualify for some sort of disocunt.  I was told that many panel beaters have accounts with them  many times larger than I spend, and they dont get discount, so why should I?

Ryan
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: s class on 11 October 2007, 01:36 PM
just remembered - today I bought 10 litres  :o of hydro fluid at the main dealer (I have 2 cars that need suspension work) - price was ZAR72 or about AUS$ 12 per litre.  From what I read here, that's cheap compared to what you guys pay.

Ryan
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: OzBenzHead on 11 October 2007, 03:37 PM
I would like to hear from other members......

"What is the most ridiculous price you have ever been given from a Mercedes Benz dealer, for a part?"

How about a new distributor for an M110 (W116):
Mercedes-Benz Australia price (through local stealership) - $2,370.  Ex-Melbourne, delivery three-four days.
MB Spares (Canberra) - $110 (genuine tristar-branded Bosch, not 'Claytons').  In stock, delivery next day.

'Nuff said.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Andrew280SEL on 11 October 2007, 09:07 PM
That is just wrong OBH!  :o

No wonder everyone calls them 'stealerships'. >:(

I haven't had the horror of dealing with the stealerships, and by the sounds of things I shouldn't.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: OzBenzHead on 11 October 2007, 11:32 PM
That is just wrong OBH!  :o

No wonder everyone calls them 'stealerships'. >:(

I haven't had the horror of dealing with the stealerships, and by the sounds of things I shouldn't.

I must grant credit where it's due, though: the local stealership is usually a good place (and certainly the only local one) to buy the correct fuses for my Benzes.  They're even an acceptable price (like cents).  Pretty useless and overpriced for anything else.

The former principal of the local stealership (in its and his former guises) advised me years ago to find myself a good independent service place, as his workshop employees were now all 'technicians', and anything vaguely physical and more complex than changing an oil filter was beyond their computer-based knowledge or interest.  I give him 10 out of nine for honesty, at least.  (Boris used to be that fellow's wife's car.)

Needless to say, I followed his advice.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Des on 11 October 2007, 11:41 PM
Styria, I hope you didn't think I was having a go at you, just making some comments about prices of parts, you don't decide the prices MB charges you for the parts.

I do appreciate your help in these matters as you have always been a most helpful chap and others here will testify to that.

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: 116Benz on 12 October 2007, 12:52 AM
Styria, I hope you didn't think I was having a go at you, just making some comments about prices of parts, you don't decide the prices MB charges you for the parts.
I do appreciate your help in these matters as you have always been a most helpful chap and others here will testify to that.

Absolutley. Your on the money Des!
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Andrew280SEL on 12 October 2007, 12:56 AM
+1 to that! :)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: oscar on 12 October 2007, 01:51 AM
Here's an interesting video of the Classic Centre in CA.  Still committed to providing parts "no matter how old the car is". 

http://youtube.com/watch?v=AXMuY-c-Om0 (http://youtube.com/watch?v=AXMuY-c-Om0)

I find it amazing that of all the MB's sold in the US post WW2, 72% are still on the road and he quotes there being 550,000 classic MB's in the US.  It's a good speech but surely they're missing the point that a lot are at risk of becoming wrecks due to ridiculous parts prices.   It's hardly a commitment when that percentage is likely to fall due to the unjustified exorbitant parts prices.

The old Benz market is completely different to the new Benz market and I honestly believe keeping old benzes on the road does not affect new car sales.  It's a testament to the company and free advertising to see older benzes on the road.  And surely they'd move more product, spares and new cars.  Case in point, that d-jet manifold pressure sensor @ $2200 was the quote for brettj.  How many of those would they sell a month?  If they were priced at $300-500, still a bit steep at the top end but they'd probably make more money by selling more at a cheaper price.  And what about hubcaps. 50-60-70 dollars.  100 dollars maybe.  Who on earth will pay $500 other than to replace the hubcaps on museum pieces.

Title: classic centre video
Post by: nathan on 12 October 2007, 07:56 AM
thread hijack, yoinks!

oscar, perhaps when he says 72% of MBs sold in the US after the war are still on the road, maybe as a silly yank he is referring to the iraq war!  seriuosly though, id agree with that figure for mid 80s on cars in the US but not before that, definitely not...its on 72% as a figure because several hundred thousand of each model range fom the 90s on were sold cf several thousand of each model before the 80 (Des, dont bring 123 figrues into this! i know theres shitloads)...so really, there wouldnt be many 'old' mercs left as benz priced them off the road but they miff the figrues so it sounds good i reckon...clever statistics!
cynically
nathan
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: s class on 12 October 2007, 10:11 AM
Certainly W140's can be costly to run, but often that is a result of previous owners' negligence.  Maybe because I'm acclimatised to this, but presently I am finding 6.9 ownership pleasantly cost effective. 

I discovered something amazing at the main dealer - for recent models - say W203/211 onwards, bumpers, rear view mirrors etc come pre-painted - you order with your VIN.  Can you imagine what this does to the cost of inventory - EVERY item has to be stocked in EVERY colour.  

Ryan
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: carl888 on 13 October 2007, 05:13 AM
I think we need to put all this in perspective.  I am old enough to have restored and run classic cars pre-internet in the late 1980's.  I remember when it was necessary to jump on an airplane to the States and Europe then spend three weeks touring swap meetings and car shows chasing new and used parts than to buy bits here.  Not because they were over priced in Australia, but because you couldn't buy them here at all! 

What about 32% sales tax in the late 1990's and parts only coming in by sea freight?  I still have my old Agfa microfiche viewer for spare parts catalogues that I used in the 80's and 90's. Service and spare parts books could not be purchased unless you were an authorised dealer and I had to bribe a service manager $200 cash to accidentally sell me a set of fiche for my car!

But the fact is, if it wasn't for the efforts of the "Stealership" in the first place, then none of us would have a 116 now.  We should also be thankful that we have a choice, we can order the parts from our local authoroised dealer, we can support an independant, we can cross reference any Bosch part because they all have that 9 digit code on them so we can buy direct from Bosch if we need to.  We can order parts electronically from just about anywhere.  Freight charges are moderate and fast, pretty hard not to have anything in your hand within 6 days from order from overseas.

Finally, we can jump on this great forum and ask people all around the world what they do, we can whinge and bitch, but the fact is, we have never had it better.  We can get a part number, download the workshop manual, even check the colour chart and decipher the options codes.  We can even swap parts amongst ourselves.  People on this forum have even sent me parts for free!

My 280 SE cost $17,650 AUD on the road in early 1974.  That was about the same price as a single story terrace house in Carlton which would sell for about $500,000 of todays money.  We are lucky that 116's are very very cheap now and haven't gone the way of Ferrari Daytona's and Porsche 911 RS 2.7's.....just about any 116 can be bought for no more than 4 months depreciation on a new Commodore.

I'm not saying that some parts are not expensive, because many are, but we must all be thankful we have so many resources at our fingertips today. 

Regards,

Carl.

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 13 October 2007, 09:28 AM
The various Presidents from the MB Clubs are meeting from around the world in Stuttgart next week. I have passed on this thread to Stu Hammel - M100 club President, as he, and others, are taking up this issue, and the issue of availability of parts, at this meeting.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: nim205 on 13 October 2007, 12:50 PM
The guy in the Youtube link told it as it is: "a viable business". It all boils down to how much people are willing to dish out for a hobby, and apparently it is quite a lot in the case of a classic MB.

The only way to lower prices is by lowering demand or increasing supply. The internet has done just that. To give an example, my local dealership wanted about $500 USD for a cold-start injector. I got it from Autohausaz for about $150, and the MB dealership will be stuck with their parts until they realise they have to make a smaller profit if they want to sell.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Andrew280SEL on 13 October 2007, 04:16 PM



But the fact is, if it wasn't for the efforts of the "Stealership" in the first place, then none of us would have a 116 now....

...Finally, we can jump on this great forum and ask people all around the world what they do, we can whinge and bitch, but the fact is, we have never had it better.  We can get a part number, download the workshop manual, even check the colour chart and decipher the options codes.  We can even swap parts amongst ourselves.  People on this forum have even sent me parts for free!




Very true.

I'm such a bitch. 8)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: oscar on 13 October 2007, 11:58 PM
Carl, you make some good points and it reminds of someone, can't remember who, posting a while back on the difficulties faced by owners of marques no longer in existence whereby no official parts stream exist.  Ingenuity of individuals or groups the only resource for fabricating some items.  There's no way I could have done what I've done, or know what I know had it not been for the net, online catalogues, the forum and relatively cheap shipping plus the quick clearance of items thru customs in Aus when the value is under $1K.  No complaints here.

Nim, I agree with the "viable business" comment in the video and I have to think in big US terms of how much for example the Pebble Beach kind of attendees will spend on a complete resto.  No doubt, price isn't an issue there.  Reliable availability is.

I'll still whinge though about the ridiculous v the reasonable of course.  Only making the point that the company themselves, and the dealers are pricing themselves out of a possible market gain in OEM parts.  I wouldn't expect supermarket style pricing motivated by quantity selling at clearance prices, however, I would guess more competitive reasonable pricing and parts availability would lead to more sales and an increase in profits.

Nathan, I got my doubts about certain figures too.  For one, even we all had a debate sometime ago with no finite answer as to whether the w116 could be classed as a classic.  So how many of the 550,000 are classics, and are mainstream 80's and 90's MB's classed as classics, and do they make up the bulk of the 72% of all MB's sold in the US still on the roads.
Title: thread hijack!
Post by: nathan on 14 October 2007, 07:37 AM
Oscar,
you know a good slab of that 72% would be 124s and 126s (40% of people know this ;)!)

its funny though, mums still got her 124 wagen we bought off the dock in 1990...i cant consider this car classic, although its now a 20+ yr old design, as i grew up with it...i have trouble considering cars old when they existed in my youth...which is why i dont necessarily still see the 116 as an old car, although im starting to now as i hardly ever see them on the roads anymore (too many of the 20 yr old miners are driving 70 thousand $ HSV utes rather than classic motoring!)

attached is a pic of old faithful at the fremantle docks, by the way, what is the car behind it between the shitty rangies
another pic of its predecessor, our 123 wagen dad collected form the factory in germany and drove around before bringing back to perth...my goal is to one day own a tidy silver wagen to match the silver 6.9
(http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/2685/300tevv1.jpg)
(http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/139/280teais4.jpg)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: 116Benz on 14 October 2007, 08:14 AM
HOLY CRAP! another 300TE in Almandine Red! I had one of those.

(keeping the thread on track) A while ago, there was an MB incentive for W123 & W201 Owners to get discount rates on parts and accessories, in order to bring back money to MB and not go into the coffers of other places. In the U.K BMW have a cheap alternative (still uses BMW parts, just sometimes reco'd, and a lower labour rate). Still, I wonder if we would all show up and get our cars servced there if MB was to do something similiar.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: oscar on 14 October 2007, 08:45 AM
Don't suppose you still have that round number plate 8)  Great pics.
Shitty rangies indeed :D

Anyway, this may sound a bit too coincidental for this thread but I swear, whilst fueling up on Friday, a guy walks out of the inkjet cartridge place next door to the service station and starts asking me questions about the 350.  He said he couldn't get over how good it looked from his window 15feet away, he just had to check it out in person.  We're standing at the back and he's saying how good the paint was and how does it go? How much have I spent?  Nearly $9000 now I said, (halve that if MB had realistic parts prices ;D ).  The best bit though, he asks - what is it, a 380? He looks at the badge as I say 350.  He asks what year 1980 something? Nope, 1973, it's 34 years old.  :o Nearly floored the poor bloke.  Yes, great cars indeed we agreed.  We went our separate ways wearing ear to ear grins.  At that moment Jennifer Hawkins could have walked up and asked me out for a movie, I wouldn't have noticed her. (Unless she was naked maybe) :D 

But how's that for advertising, living the dream, keeping up appearances, giving MB credibility for quality design, engineering and durability 34 years on.

I deserve cheaper parts and I second the motion.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: 116Benz on 14 October 2007, 09:04 AM
Plates? no unfortunatley, In the pic is some 190's, Rangies, a Jag and a few Volvo 240's. People like that always make you grin.
I had a google, the BMW solution is called BMW plus four (BMW's over 4 yrs of age, other than that theres no age limit), cheaper parts, labour etc.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 14 October 2007, 11:39 AM
But who does Autohaus get it from ? MB of course, so if Autohaus can sell it for that price, why can't MB ?



The only way to lower prices is by lowering demand or increasing supply. The internet has done just that. To give an example, my local dealership wanted about $500 USD for a cold-start injector. I got it from Autohausaz for about $150, and the MB dealership will be stuck with their parts until they realise they have to make a smaller profit if they want to sell.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: nim205 on 14 October 2007, 01:24 PM
But who does Autohaus get it from ? MB of course, so if Autohaus can sell it for that price, why can't MB ?

I'm not familiar with the specifics, but I can attest that the part I received was a brand new Bosch part, in an original Bosch (not MB) box.

While ordering online I had some concerns, so I called the Autohausaz customer support, and the friendly lady on the other line matched the MB and Bosch #'s making sure it was indeed correct, and recommending I buy a gasket for it as well. I paid about $50 USD for 3 day shipping of this part and a lot of other stuff I needed (total order $680).

At the dealership it was, admittedly, simpler. I presented the data card, and the parts guy looked it up on his computer, told me there was such a part in stock, and the price it cost. After successful CPR, I said "no thanks" and left.

Since Bosch is the OEM for the D-Jet, and MB buys from them just like Autohausaz, but in addition to Arizona also keeps a worldwide network of overpriced storerooms just so any snot-nosed nobody can walk in, flash a 32 year old data card, and get what he wants in just a few minutes, their enormous overhead is surely reflected in the final price. Still, I'll buy from the cheapest source. But that's just me. I'm sure everybody else will gladly pay 3-4 times the lowest market price for the fun of it.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: OzBenzHead on 14 October 2007, 03:24 PM
[...] But how's that for advertising, living the dream, keeping up appearances, giving MB credibility for quality design, engineering and durability 34 years on.

That is true of my experience, too.

Whether it be Boris (116) or my W108 (Karl) or Bela (W112 coupe), I frequently get similar reactions. Especially Boris, because he doesn't look all that old or "classicky", blows them away when they are told his age.  They then drive away in their Commonwhores and Frauds, grinning and shaking their heads.

I've even had total strangers offering their commiserations this week when they see Boris's hail-battered bonnet.

Go the tristar!   ;D ;D
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: carl888 on 14 October 2007, 04:06 PM
But who does Autohaus get it from ? MB of course, so if Autohaus can sell it for that price, why can't MB ?



The only way to lower prices is by lowering demand or increasing supply. The internet has done just that. To give an example, my local dealership wanted about $500 USD for a cold-start injector. I got it from Autohausaz for about $150, and the MB dealership will be stuck with their parts until they realise they have to make a smaller profit if they want to sell.

Hi Craig,

The reason is that an authorised dealer cannot buy parts direct from Bosch like we (Or AutoHausaz) can.  They are obliged to purchase everything through Mercedes-Benz.

Regards,

Carl.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: CraigS on 14 October 2007, 11:10 PM
That may be true, but these are what I would call "sub-contractor" parts. What about all the others that are MB exclusive ? For example, the wire holder bracket, which autohaus sells for $3.33 or thereabouts and Bill bought his for A$7.00 odd. I don't think Autohaus would be buying this from anyone except MB, so why the difference ? This may be a low cost part, but the variation is indicative of what is happening.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: carl888 on 15 October 2007, 05:51 AM
Good point Craig!

I dunno.

Regards,

Carl.

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: fantasyfreddy on 17 October 2007, 05:32 PM
I read in "Battle of the Diesel Beaters" in Car and Driver Mag (in which a 1980 300sd kinda won the  cross-USA race), about a company called www.adsitco.com.   They look like they have great Mercedes replacement parts (new not made by benz, and refurbished made by benz) including engines for decent prices.  Good luck!
Then there is always EBay, or junk yards too!
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Sev on 25 October 2007, 12:46 AM
Patrick among others in the past has made reference to the ridiculous prices Mercedes Benz seem to expect for their parts.

Was chatting today to a forum member, we were talking about the $500 AU new price Mercedes want for 1 single, solitary hubcap, unpainted.

Just makes you shake your head in disgust really.

Yes I am an ambassador to Mercedes excellent supply of parts for cars going back decades, but, and its a BIG but they need to be reasonably priced.

yes I don't expect a new hubcap for $20, $200? maybe, $500 odd, when you add that up for 4 is 2 grand.
more than what many of our vintage W123', W116's would bring on the market.


just a little rant,

 :(


Do you think this unreasonable pricing is worldwide? Or do you think it's limited to Australia?
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: koan on 25 October 2007, 10:43 AM

Do you think this unreasonable pricing is worldwide? Or do you think it's limited to Australia?


I noticed a big jump in dealership parts prices when Daimler-Chrysler bought out privately owned "Mercedes of Melbourne".

This was coincident with 116s becoming "classics" so I don't know if total ownership of the dealership was the cause.

koan
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: ptashek on 04 September 2012, 03:12 PM
I would like to hear from other members......

"What is the most ridiculous price you have ever been given from a Mercedes Benz dealer, for a part?"

I'm resurrecting this old thread, as I think MB needs to be shamed publicly for their pricing policy. Yes, they do a great job on keeping stock of OEM parts, but those parts can be gotten elsewhere and I'm not convinced those are necessarily worse grade as MB (and other OEMs, actually) would want everyone to believe.

I was yesterday quoted for timing chain replacement (chain, tensioner, all three sprockets, guides, oilers and gaskets) by a MB service shop in Dublin, Ireland a nifty sum of 4852.04 euro (parts and labor), with the disclaimer that once the engine is stripped further costs may be incurred. Knowing local shops, I bet there would be "further costs". OK, I understand doing all the sprockets is a big job, but it can't be THAT big  :o

For that amount, I could almost buy a fully re-built 117.986 (http://www.german-spob.de/start.php?name=ENGINE---REGENERATED-ENGINE-117.986&artikel_id=15943&start=0&language=eng&seite=details_suche_gebrteile&search_ersatzteil=117.986&paget=gebr) for Goldilocks.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Big_Richard on 04 September 2012, 03:16 PM
.

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: ptashek on 04 September 2012, 05:04 PM
that price is insane.

if you do it your self you could do it for 1/4 of that quote, or less!

Even less. I have so far found a complete set of the required parts for under 450EUR, new. I haven't done anything mechanical of this magnitude on a car, but potentially facing a 4852eur bill I have every incentive to try :)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: entresz on 04 September 2012, 05:24 PM
I had to buy a fuel pump for my 450SE recently, and at one place I was quoted $800..... yet another MB parts dealer near by had the same part for $250....... it's obscene!
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: WGB on 04 September 2012, 07:14 PM
Even less. I have so far found a complete set of the required parts for under 450EUR, new. I haven't done anything mechanical of this magnitude on a car, but potentially facing a 4852eur bill I have every incentive to try :)

You can probably do it for less than that and I have self taught myself due to the high cost of getting others to do it.

It can be a very satisfying experience when it all goes right.

Bill

Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: ZCarFan on 04 September 2012, 08:14 PM
I would like to hear from other members......

"What is the most ridiculous price you have ever been given from a Mercedes Benz dealer, for a part?"

I'm resurrecting this old thread, as I think MB needs to be shamed publicly for their pricing policy. Yes, they do a great job on keeping stock of OEM parts, but those parts can be gotten elsewhere and I'm not convinced those are necessarily worse grade as MB (and other OEMs, actually) would want everyone to believe.

I was yesterday quoted for timing chain replacement (chain, tensioner, all three sprockets, guides, oilers and gaskets) by a MB service shop in Dublin, Ireland a nifty sum of 4852.04 euro (parts and labor), with the disclaimer that once the engine is stripped further costs may be incurred. Knowing local shops, I bet there would be "further costs". OK, I understand doing all the sprockets is a big job, but it can't be THAT big  :o

For that amount, I could almost buy a fully re-built 117.986 (http://www.german-spob.de/start.php?name=ENGINE---REGENERATED-ENGINE-117.986&artikel_id=15943&start=0&language=eng&seite=details_suche_gebrteile&search_ersatzteil=117.986&paget=gebr) for Goldilocks.

For that amount of money I'd expect you could have a machine shop create the parts from billets.  Maybe less even.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: TJ 450 on 04 September 2012, 09:27 PM
That price means that they would rather you go elsewhere! I assume this was the dealer?

Tim
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: Beastie on 04 September 2012, 11:25 PM
That price means that they would rather you go elsewhere! I assume this was the dealer?

Tim
That's exactly what I was thinking. That's the classic "we don't really feel comfortable telling you that we don't want to work on your car, so here's a big ridiculous quote that will make you go away and never come back" tactic. If it's a dealership, they're probably growing fat and lazy from doing services on new cars that basically only need visual inspections & fluid changes.

They get to appear to be willing and able to do the job when really they are not willing at all. And hey, if you decide to get the work done there anyway they wont mind too much because they know they'll be making a ton of money. It's win-win for them.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: adamb on 05 September 2012, 04:56 AM
Ptashek, this is one of the reasons I value this and other forums. We can exchange experiences and opinions to avoid getting ripped off. I'm not a fan of the dealerships since they were taken over by MB directly. They are extremely focused on profit and have lost interest in the enthusiast for the most part. One cause is the elevated reputation gained over the golden years. You'll find that Skoda dealers do a much better job as they try to build a credible brand. Also MB have been doing nasty things to independent suppliers of classic parts. Many German outfits can no longer supply MB branded parts at all forcing you to go to the dealer.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: ptashek on 05 September 2012, 04:20 PM
That price means that they would rather you go elsewhere! I assume this was the dealer?

Tim

One of their officially listed service workshops.
I agree, that the quote was probably this high to make me go away, and it did ;)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: ptashek on 05 September 2012, 04:32 PM
Ptashek, this is one of the reasons I value this and other forums. We can exchange experiences and opinions to avoid getting ripped off. I'm not a fan of the dealerships since they were taken over by MB directly. They are extremely focused on profit and have lost interest in the enthusiast for the most part. One cause is the elevated reputation gained over the golden years. You'll find that Skoda dealers do a much better job as they try to build a credible brand. Also MB have been doing nasty things to independent suppliers of classic parts. Many German outfits can no longer supply MB branded parts at all forcing you to go to the dealer.

Indeed. I'm driving an Opel as a daily driver, and it gets serviced at the dealership just because they charge sane money and do a good job.
And as to sharing, so far I'm browsing this site back and forth, and have already learned a ton of stuff. So, thanks everyone.
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: oversize on 05 September 2012, 07:57 PM
They force you away and yet won't help with part numbers and service manuals and then they hunt down aftermarket parts suppliers...  Sometimes I don't know why we bother.  >:(  They should really take a look at themselves and change their attitude.  If they support the enthusiasts of older models and maintain a good reputation for service and reliability at a reasonable cost, they should therefore sell more new ones...
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: ptashek on 13 February 2013, 12:15 PM
Here's another sample of how MB screws everyone on parts prices.
A1153201589

Guess what...?
MB list price in Germany: 21.69EUR ex. delivery and 10% club discount
SeekPart24 list price in Germany: 11.30EUR ex. delivery

MB delivers just the stabiliser bar, the Febi kit from SeekPart ships also with a set of two new self-locking nuts.
But that's not all. MB parts are supposed to be nothing but the best quality, right? Well...

This is exactly the part MB shipped to me, bar the (not even self-)locking nuts: http://seekpart24.com/trw/rod-strut-stabiliser-jts145?c=100577 (and it costs 12.65EUR online!)
TRW makes an immense amount of automotive parts (for GM/Opel at least), but the Febi part just looks and feels like much higher quality workmanship (I've actually bought one).

If you're still thinking that MB parts are the best your money can get, you may want to think again :)
Title: Re: ridiculous prices continue........
Post by: oversize on 13 February 2013, 03:22 PM
This issue has been in the media here recently and it doesn't just apply to car parts....  We pay more for everything and I seriously doubt they can blame it all on freight and taxes.

BTW the most I've ever been quoted was $11K for a bare 6.9 cylinder head!