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Garage => Test Drive => Topic started by: rumb on 01 September 2015, 07:36 AM

Title: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 01 September 2015, 07:36 AM
Hi,

Just received my 2 6.9's.  One is barely running and the other probably a parts car.

Trying to figure out the year (production date) of them

first is 0162, 2nd is 1951.

looking at production numbers on wiki,  the first would appear to be a 1975 and euro?  title says 1976 and has been represented to me as a US car. it has cloth interior and euro bumpers. I need to poke around and see if it has cats on it and the other teltales to see what I can.

the 2nd would be 1976 - titled as 1977 though.  from paperwork I have, looks like it spent a few years in Europe first. original service books shows 1330 km service done on 1/14/77. By 1982 it had reached 136181 km. Car must of had a lot of highway miles on it.

both are probably registration dated from first registration, not YOM.

need to figure out if first is a euro though.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 01 September 2015, 09:09 AM
You can see the month and year of production on the metal tag on the driver side B pillar.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 01 September 2015, 02:06 PM
Easy to tell if its a euro as the euros have an engine oil cooler, and no EGR or air pump equipment. 

The early car is very likely to be a euro as afaik it was only into late 1976 that the US spec 6.9 was introduced.  Would be a real shame to part out such an early euro, they have some nice quirks that differentiate them from the later cars. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: wbrian63 on 02 September 2015, 05:26 AM
Not often I see a sequence # lower than mine - good score on 0162.

Wikipedia says that #1950 was the lowest sequence # that would have come to N. America.

1975 vin's run up to 474
1976 475 to 1475.

They don't start over with zero at each model year, so sequence #'s, so you add each of the model year #'s together to get your car's placement in the model year hierarchy.

Based on that, 1951 was the 2nd car produced for the 1977 model year. Based on the park-bench bumpers and the quad headlamps, it probably was a N. America delivered car, but that's no guarantee. Cars imported to the US were "federalized" - but I'm not certain if that extends to having the 5mph bumpers fitted. Both #521 and #1164 were imported to the US and federalized (I can see the added interior door bracing), but when I purchased each, they were fitted with euro-style headlamps, and neither shows (showed) signs of ever having been fitted with the US-spec bumpers (a huge job).

Also - US-delivered cars were fitted with an auxiliary transmission cooler pump. You'll find it right on the bottom of the engine - the 1975 car will have an idler pulley in it's place.

The data plate on the radiator crossmember will tell you the country of destination for the car - I don't remember the code, others on this site will.

As others have noted, euro-delivered cars will be devoid of any emissions control. No cats, no EGR (easily spotted mounted onto the top of the exhaust manifold - don't remember which side).

Typically, these cars also were fitted with manual climate control. Many also had velour seat covers - my former #1164 was so-equipped.

The quick tell-all will be the presence of an oil cooler (you'll see it as a small extra radiator mounted vertically on the left-hand side of the car adjacent to the engine radiator). No made-for-N. America 6.9's had an engine oil cooler.

Good score - plan on rust removal - ask me how I know... http://forum.w116.org/mechanicals/6-9-521-restoration/msg113855/#msg113855
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 02 September 2015, 06:58 AM
#162 is def a euro, it has the import Federalization tag on the B pillar, and the vin tag on the radiator support. I dont really think this car will survive, lots more rust in rockers, very worn out velour seats, and is already missing small engine bits.  the air cleaner was soaked in oil, looks like bad blow by. I plan on using as a parts car for the other one. I found steel plates welded inside the front bumper support on the euro bumpers.  it has US lights.  If anyone is interested in parts let me know.  I do plan on keeping most of the 6.9 specific parts. The rest of the blue interior is in pretty decent shape, door panels, plastic trim and carpets.  the seats are just plain worn, though not horribly crappy.

#1951 is in much better condition, leather and interior will clean up well with a lot of work. I have a lot of the original manuals and docs for it. build card, maintenance book, owners manual in english and german, the parts diagram book had to be tossed it was covered in black mold, and user manual for the Webasto heater! Also becker radio books.

There is also a Internationaler Zulussungsschein. The car was owned and driven by a German until 1982, then it looks like a person from Las Vegas bought it and drove it in Europe for 3 months. Car came back to Nevada and then was owned by a Doctor. Have a few receipts from 1985 to  1991.  Then car traveled to Colorado , someone tried to work on it in 2010, but I'm pretty sure they did not get it running very well.  Now it's mine. 

There are no tags on B pillar or radiator support.  I think the radiator support has been changed as it has different paint color on it. The car currently barely starts.  It will fire up for 10 seconds then die out. I suspect filthy fuel system, will start with removing and cleaning everything. The 10 seconds it runs sound good though. The build card says it was built on 12/28/1976.

Also need a new ring gear.  starting is hard with a bad spot on it.  What is easier access, pull engine or just trans?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: wbrian63 on 03 September 2015, 06:04 AM
I'm pretty sure I have a spare ring gear.

If you've got a good (no rust) fuel tank between the two, I'd be interested.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 03 September 2015, 09:48 AM
I thought I would complete my bio here and then start posting in the mechanical/interior sections for questions I have.

Anyway I have had my first MB '68 250S for 40 years, my dad bought it new.  have had many others since. Currently have the 250S, '91 300SE, and a '98 SL500, and now the 6.9's. I am active on the benzworld forum, mostly in the Vintage forum.  My handle there is also rumb.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 08 September 2015, 11:53 AM
Brian,  I should have an extra gas tank, will probably be a while before I can pull off, let me know if interested - email me.

Thought I would also chronicle my car here, and ask relevant question in the other sections.

Spent many hours power washing wheel wells and underside of car. It had been heavily undercoated, and in this case it does seem to have protected things pretty well and not made things worse. Very slowly I have been able to blast most of it off.  Have found a half dozen rust through spots, and most do not seem too horrible to deal with. The drivers side rocker has been quite abused and is caved in by idiot handlers.  I think the front jack point is bad for sure. I knew I would be replacing the rockers when I bought the car, will have to see as I get into it if I have to do the inner panels also.  The rest of the rust in the usual places is not to large. scored a set of 4 very good condition painted 6.5" bundt wheels on fleabay for $31!  one is an original 108, the rest are italian repops.

Found Italian air horns installed under battery tray with a mess of wiring that I need to remove. original horns are still there.

Placed several large orders for suspension, fuel, filters, and rubber parts.  I plan of doing first scrub of filthy mushroom interior while I wait for parts.  Leather will restore nicely, will have to redye them. Carpet is filthy will just replace later.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: beagle2022 on 09 September 2015, 01:57 AM
Hi. If your carpet is just plain filthy (as opposed to worn out) can I suggest a high pressure water hose after pre-wash stain remover?  I used it as a last resort on mine and it all came out remarkably well.   A testimony to the material quality.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 09 September 2015, 10:10 AM
In case your wondering I bought it on fleabay.
MERCEDES 450SEL 450 SEL 6.9 LEFT INNER ROCKER PANEL FRAME MEMBER 116 610 01 09
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 September 2015, 01:07 PM
Started changing rear accumulators. PO heaped abuse and idiocy on car. the one rear he did change was with a front one. somehow he tore a 1.5" hole in the trunk floor around one of the bolt holes.  guess a bit of welding will fix.

Got fuel pump and assorted items ready to go.

started draining oil. I was surprised that there was no oil at all in the side tank. Is this normal when the car has been sitting for a while?  Decided to remove big hoses and really clean tank.  Need to find or borrow some big wrenches as those hoses are on tight!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 27 September 2015, 01:58 PM
You mean dry sump tank empty :o not good. That thing carries about 3 gal of oil alone plus the oil in the pan and filter about 12 liters total.
Careful with those hose connections they are super tight from rust normally.
Could be you have a leak from the rubber hoses between the oil tank and pan. Better take a good look down there...
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 September 2015, 04:19 PM
Yeah, sump tank was empty, that is why I am pulling it and removing hoses. There was a lot of oil in the pan.

The hoses all look fine.

Is there a check valve somewhere?  How does the oil normally get out of the sump?  thru the oil pump?

I cant currently start the engine due to other work. I've only had the engine running a few minutes at most since I got the car.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 27 September 2015, 05:29 PM
One hose for feed, one for return and the thinnest is a vent pipe.
There is a check valve in the filter housing and one in the oil pump.
Hot idle gauge should be in the middle and must immediately peg to max as you hit the throttle.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 28 September 2015, 07:12 AM
Let's hope it's a check valve.  will take a few days to find appropriate wrenches to take hoses off.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 04 October 2015, 11:16 AM
Well, got the gas tank back in properly now, after welding in a patch where PO tore the hole in the trunk. Still need to put in the cover panel in the trunk and the pump assy.

Bought a set of large crow's feet wrenches, - 28-36mm and an extra breaker bar. Made easy work of removing large lines from the dry sump tank.  scraped a huge amount of crud off outside and power washed.  Too bad there was rust and some pin holes in the tank.  Now I get to take the other one off the parts car.

Cleaned injectors and fuel lines and got all that back together.  Sorted out a few wires under battery tray and got most of windscreen and headlight washer parts/ hoses out and new parts for that ordered.

Oh yeah, found a temp sensor mounted in the bumper with a non-std wire running back thru the firewall.  havent looked for the other end yet, suspect some aftermarket stuff somewhere up there?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 04 October 2015, 02:54 PM
Can you post some pics of the pinholes in the tank perhaps?  I want to tackle this job soon on mine and would like to check the spots prone to rust.  I am guessing around the mounting brackets?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 06 October 2015, 03:17 PM
The pin holes are on the top. This tank was caked in oily dirt on most side and the top.  It is about 20% rust areas, in 4-5 different areas. that caked on dirt holds water and leads to rust.

I'm not sure why it was so oily, maybe it was the pin holes leaking oil for a long time?

I got the other one out and it is maybe 40% rusty, mostly the side by the fender and the front.  not much caked on dirt and the rust looks lighter than the other. also not very oily.  the brackets did have large gravel/dirt firmly attached.

This is an area of the car that a good washing with pressure hose would be good to do regularly.

At this point the second tank is out, but with all three hoses attached.  I could only get them loose from the oil pan, the ones on the sump are quite rusted on. I even tried double breaker bars and no luck so far. 

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 06 October 2015, 03:28 PM
I feel your pain on the hose fittings on the tank side :o  Man those things are just in the absolute worst spot for rust to take hold!  Problem is if you use too much heat on the coupling you end up melting the rubber inside the coupling and then it becomes impossible to get those off easily so you cannot easily reuse the couplings.
The oil at the top of the tank is from decades of oil top ups and changes which missed the mark and made it's lazy way down the hole in the fender and then gets caked with rust and mud.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: wbrian63 on 07 October 2015, 07:34 AM
The pin holes are on the top. This tank was caked in oily dirt on most side and the top.  It is about 20% rust areas, in 4-5 different areas. that caked on dirt holds water and leads to rust.

I'm not sure why it was so oily, maybe it was the pin holes leaking oil for a long time?

I got the other one out and it is maybe 40% rusty, mostly the side by the fender and the front.  not much caked on dirt and the rust looks lighter than the other. also not very oily.  the brackets did have large gravel/dirt firmly attached.

This is an area of the car that a good washing with pressure hose would be good to do regularly.

At this point the second tank is out, but with all three hoses attached.  I could only get them loose from the oil pan, the ones on the sump are quite rusted on. I even tried double breaker bars and no luck so far.

Suggest you clean the tank thoroughly to remove all vestiges of oil - I'd try gasoline first, then follow that with acetone, then with water.

Then get out your blue-point wrench (torch) and heat the living daylights out of the fittings. This will destroy the hoses - in fact, I'd cut the hoses off as close to the fittings as possible. Once you get the fittings good and hot - smoking hot - that should break the hold that the rust has. Let them cool before attempting to remove. Worst thing you can do is rush the process and kink one of the pipes coming out of the tank.

If you can't get the tank into serviceable condition - I have a good non-leaking one I can let you have for reasonable $...

They also show up from time to time on eBay - sometimes for reasonable money, sometimes not...
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 09 October 2015, 03:16 PM
project creep.  Since I'm in-process on the sump tanks, I've decided to tidy up the right inner fender. Most everything is removed now, need to weld in a new battery tray cross member from the parts car.  the one in is missing about 5-6" in the middle that must of been rusted/hacked out.

Have a couple of cans of anthracite gray (172) spray paint on the way.

Took both radiators out and again the parts car wins with better radiator and correct fan shroud.

It the fan suppose to be painted black?  or just plain aluminum?

cleaned up another 108 pn bundt wheel and using for spare. Got trunk all  back together with cleaned gas tank. flat black paint on the spare cover panel and transferred the hinges from parts car.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 09 October 2015, 05:42 PM
Nice, slow and steady.  I have taken the long view with regards to getting my 6.9 in top notch shape.  I think if you try and tackle too many areas at once it is very easy to get overwhelmed.  I have to constantly remind myself that the car is almost 40 years old, so one cannot expect to get it "right" in a few months 8)
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 October 2015, 03:39 PM
Progress seems slow, though I know things are actually getting done.  It just doesnt look like it.

Focusing on inner fender.  All set up to weld in replacement battery support.

I ordered a Cad plating set from Caswell plating.  I couldnt bear the thought of putting all the little brackets back in looking shabby.

After the welding is done, then time to sand a little, put POR15 on the rust areas, reseal all the seams and then paint.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 22 November 2015, 11:28 AM
Progress report.  Besides servicing, restoring and cleaning fuel system - done, radiator - done, and hydraulic system, I have been working on restoring wheel wells. Of course this necessitates stripping all components, cleaning replating, replacing or servicing. I bought a yellow copy-cad system and am replating all the brackets and bolts. It work pretty good, but takes a long time.

Currently rebuilding hydraulic hoses.

Pictures show wheel well preasure washed and stripped of components, then a couple with rubberized texture applied this morning.

Then some of inner wheel well, radiator supports and headlight bucket.

Finally the Webasto heater and a pile of parts glass bead blasted and ready for plating this week.

Excuse the blurry, my hands shake too much to take good pictures anymore.



Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 22 November 2015, 02:01 PM
Nice work!

Are you planning on refurbing the Webasto unit?  From what I've heard they are notorious for engine fires :o
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 22 November 2015, 03:56 PM
I should say on the wheel wells, I first scraped off the aftermarket undercoating, scrubbed everything with simple green, then treated all the rusty spots with POR15 and fixed 2 small rust holes and sealed all the seams. That was followed with the new textured rubberized undercoat.  In a few days it will get painted.

The Webasto for now I'm probably just going to make it look nice, but probably not get it working.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 03 December 2015, 02:21 PM
Finally got to put parts back on car. Made new hydraulic hoses using replated ends. Was surprisingly easy to do. Assembled strut unit and installed in car along with refurbed brake cylinder and new hose. Trial set wheel bearings and late today received .01mm dial indicator from amazone. Yesterday plumbed washer hoses and installed pump. Now I get to repeat the whole process for the left side of the car...
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: floyd111 on 03 December 2015, 07:03 PM
Almost a shame to think road dust will cover all of that plating one day.. :P
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 07 December 2015, 02:33 PM
Got new keys from dealer.  Guess what, they don't fit anything. The one old key I have is a master and only does ignition and drivers door, and it doesnt fit trunk or glovebox.

The new keys dont fit anything, but the master does grudgingly turn the drivers door, but feels stiff and weird.

Dealer suggest locksmith could redo all the lock tumblers.   


 :-\ :-\
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 07 December 2015, 02:36 PM
Not much help but my master key opens all locks, driver door,  passenger door,  glove box and trunk.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: ptashek on 07 December 2015, 03:20 PM
As daantjie mentioned, the master key opens all locks. The car should've come with two of those, with one sealed in a transparent plastic sleeve attached to the build card (below is what came with my 450 from factory). The key you mentioned is the third key, also known as a service key, and yes it fits only drivers door and ignition. The dealer should be able to source a proper replacement master key based on your VIN. I'd push them harder :)
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: floyd111 on 07 December 2015, 03:41 PM
Eeh..what?
I need a card like this, WITH a key in plastic? You say this is obtainable through MB?
And.. replacing tumblers.. That is also news. Can you confirm this is possible?
Does that mean you keep the MB tumbler assemblies, but the internals of the tumblers get changed around?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: ptashek on 07 December 2015, 04:33 PM
Eeh..what?
I need a card like this, WITH a key in plastic? You say this is obtainable through MB?

I'm not certain about the card, but I think the answer is yes. The keys are definitely available from MB.
This card is the client copy of the production card that would have been delivered with the car. A second copy was usually attached to the bottom of the rear-bench.
I have both of those, with the master key still sealed. I have also another card, which I think is the factory copy of the build sheet. On of those is stamped "23 Augustus 1979" on the back, which is either when my car left the factory, or was put on the assembly line (first registered Oct 1979).

Here's how the other card looks like. Position #36 (Türschloss) is where they original key number would be. That and the VIN, and you have your master key.
Oh, it also lists all the options on the car!

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 07 December 2015, 04:39 PM
VIN and key number off of build card were supplied to MB. Field #11 is the key number.  They made keys that are for that VIN and show the correct key #. The problem I believe is that someone changed some or all the locks.  I do find it very odd that they were changed into 2 different patterns as the old master key key - actually a copy of that key - fits the drivers door and ignition only, and that the supplied new keys dont fit anything.  someone also has drilled a 1" hole by back license plate area to be able to access and unlock the trunk at some time and disconnected the vacuum mechanism. 


So someone lost all the keys and didnt know that you can get replacements from the dealer and then messed everything up.  I think I saw a receipt that the PO had bought a new key, and thought it weird that it wasnt given to me.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 07 December 2015, 04:44 PM
So my other opttion is to remove all the locks and ignitions switch from the parts car.

I will also investigate the cost as ability of a locksmith to redo all the tumblers, it that is even possible.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: gavin116 on 07 December 2015, 11:59 PM
Hi Rumb

I think what happened at some point is that your ignition lock got "sticky" and a replacement barrel was sourced from a parts carts, and perhaps the driver's door lock was changed at the same time.

My situation was this:
So, in my case, I was forced to do something as I had the double whammy mentioned above.  I knew it would just be a matter of time before the locks got totally stuck, and I would be stranded.

New lock sets are a thing of the past.  I managed to buy one of the last W116 lock sets available from Fellenbach (M-B Germany classic parts) for a non-central locking car.  The central locking set in NLA.  The parts guy and I thought in our naivety that we could simply remove the "hook" on the boot lock, and screw the central locking componentry onto the back of the new boot lock, but it's not a fit.  I might have to send it off to Belgium to the lock man to have the tangs in the barrel replaced.  So, I do have one key essentially to work everything when I get the boot barrel re-keyed, but it is also not the same lock number as on my data card.

To those of you who can live with more than one key, the news is equally as bad if your ignition barrel goes.  I know insofar as the newer key types go (like the one Lucasz pictured - square profile with the pattern cut into the key as opposed to the "teeth" being on the edge) the ignition barrel is NLA.  I do not know what M-B expect one to do when your ignition barrel is about to or has seized, as they don't actually give an alternative ignition barrel.  I found this very strange, as this key type was used in late W116's, R107's and W201's.  Now with 2 door M-B cars being quite so popular you would have thought M-B would pull themselves together and ask Huff locks to do a new production run...

So, Rumb, I'm afraid your lock issues are going to be a bit of a struggle.  Lucky for you and me, even if we did nothing to our current lock sets, we already have that wonderful anti-theft device installed in our cars: the fuel consumption...
 ;D
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 08 December 2015, 05:30 AM
But the weird part is that the new keys don't fit ANYTHING. Someone changing the glovebox and trunk doesn't make any sense. Plus that someone drilled the trunk to open it also.

I think my easiest path is to swap all the locks from the other car.


If only our cars could talk.  :o :o


PS, I found the receipt, PO bought new key on 10/4/10 that I did not get, so I would guess it didn't work then either..
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 09 December 2015, 01:29 PM
Front door handles swapped between cars, very easy to do.  Ignition key cylinder was a lot harder to do. You have to get the key in just the right spot and also then find and press the release spot just right and pull out hard.  Got cylinder plastic surround out by fashioning a stainless bicycle spoke. you have to push it in almost an inch to get to the rear of it so you can pull it out.

Well that got me 3 out of the 4.  The trunk lock from the parts car didnt work with the keys I have.  Just my luck.  See my WTB listing.

I took one trunk lock apart down to the cylinder.  I dont think they can be opened to change the tumblers.  it looks like it is staked together. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 18 January 2016, 04:10 PM
Here are some pictures of the Webasto parts. I have decided to make operational.  I found a new fuel pump that fits Porsche and is same brand and configuration. The fuel atomiser runs and make a big noise (it's suppose to be that way). It lives in the black box and is the round device with a fan. the heat exchanger looks solid and the water pump on it works.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 18 January 2016, 04:21 PM
also working on rust in left front wheel well.  you will see the rather large hole I have now. It started out only 1/2" x 2". Still working toward getting parking brake out of the way. there seems to be a few extra wires down there that need investigating. That and the oily substance the is on the rubber mat.  I have new grommets for the brake fluid reservoir on order.

I finally finished replacing the hydraulic hose with new rubber hose and fresh plated fittings.   the rear struts are ready to go back in with new boots. The hydraulic pump has been swapped for a 1998 vintage one, and got a new coil green wire.

So far I have ordered over 355 parts for the car. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 18 January 2016, 04:38 PM
What I did in that spot that rusts into the wheel well is put a drain tube in so that future water has a place to go.  It is a very tight spot to work in, and at the end the tube I put in was not big enough, so it keeps getting clogged :o  but the idea is there.  So learn from my mistake and put a large enough drain tube to exit into the wheel well, when you patch it all up.  Also make sure the drain tube sits at the absolute lowest point of the recess so you get a total drain of all fluid into that area.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 18 January 2016, 05:20 PM
Yes, it seem odd that MB did not provide a drain hole.  The W126's have nice large ones in each corner.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: floyd111 on 20 January 2016, 02:43 AM
are you gonna re-install the Webasto system, or may it be for sale?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 20 January 2016, 06:37 AM
No, I'm keeping mine...

most of one is listed here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Komplette-Standheizung-Webasto-WP1021-VE1009-Benzin-mit-Vorwahluhr-Mercedes-W126-/161600749279

you would still need the fuel pump, dial timer and the fuel lines.  search for WP1021 to find one and learn about them.
  the one listed has the  modern controller instead of the dial.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: floyd111 on 20 January 2016, 06:15 PM
so what's that gas-tank looking monstrosity about? Isnt that part of the Webasto? the eBay add does not show that.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 21 January 2016, 07:01 AM
the heat exchanger is on the underside of the ebay listed on. It's there, just doesnt show well in the picture.
Title: Tin worms
Post by: rumb on 18 February 2016, 12:18 PM
After avoiding it for as long as I could I finally removed the parking brake and other items under the dash to reveal the extent of the damages. Could be better, could be worse.  I suppose the lack of space to work under there is the biggest pain.  There are a couple of  wires added by PO's  that need to be tracked down into the center console.

I did rebuild a few wires in the engine bay and the ones to the fuel pump with new sheathing and connectors. Also installed rear struts with new hoses.

I still need to remove the 4 tiny nuts that hold the fuse box on.  I'm sure that will be another pain.  Oh well, at lest it is progress.



Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 March 2016, 11:40 AM
Here is my progress so far on fixing the rust hole under the fuse box. The previous pictures show the 2" x 5" hole in the firewall.  That was cut out and a patch panel welding in.

Gaining access to the top side is decidedly painful process, but necessary and once you actually do it, you realize that it was the correct path. First involves removing brake pedal assy fron interior of car, and all carpet and insulating panels. The are 4 small nuts holding the fuse box on.  Then the lengthy process of removing all the wires from the fuse box, labeling and making a diagram on paper. There are 2 parts to the fuse bock, they separate by simply pulling the 2 halves apart, making it a little easier to manipulate the block to access the screws holding each wire on. 

The screws holding the wires were tight, and using my electric drill provided good torque to easily pop them loose. This then gets you some movement of the fuse box, but not really enough. I then went ahead and removed the brake booster.  First it need repainting anyway and also gives you access to below it to also clean, derust and repaint underneath it. It was a tight fit pulling it out.  It also then gives you even more room to push the fuse box over and get  better access to repair the hole under it. Ordered a new brake master cylinder and seal and found a nice NOS brake fluid tank and grommets.

Stan, did you make the 2 labels that go on the brake booster?

Next I used Miracle paint and fiberglass to repair the trough under the fuse box and also in the wheel well to rebuild the still missing areas there.  I will put a second coat on, and then will use MB brushable seam sealer to cover the entire repair areas, so that the fiberglass repairs will not look like that and will look plausibly original.  Follow up with spray paint and reassemble.

I was also at this time able to fully free the wire harness on that side of the car and have cleaned the inner fender and ready to repaint that entire region. The wire harness likewise can now be cleaned and repaired as needed.

The brushable seam sealer is 005-989-64-20-09
There are 2 of these little clips that hold the brake sensor wire and the barking brake cable. 000-988-33-78.  there is another one on the other inner fender.
Sprayable body shultz 001-986-46-10

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 March 2016, 11:46 AM
more pictures
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 March 2016, 11:47 AM
and
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 March 2016, 11:48 AM
wire harness
Title: Body Shultz
Post by: rumb on 15 March 2016, 11:30 AM
shultz arrived.

Brushable and sprayable
Title: lug nut card
Post by: rumb on 15 March 2016, 11:33 AM
anyone know a part number for the lug nut card?
Title: Re: Body Schutz
Post by: rumb on 15 March 2016, 11:34 AM
chutz arrived.

sprayable and brushable
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: marku on 15 March 2016, 11:41 AM
Only ever used the brushed underseal before and never been happy with it. Recently did the interior of the front wings of the 450, after some repairs, with the spray schutz and it gives a good textured finish which can be over sprayed I think. Really pleased with it.
Title: Re: Body Shultz
Post by: Zaxxon on 15 March 2016, 05:40 PM
shultz arrived.

Brushable and sprayable

Hi!

Would you mind telling us where you were able to get the Teroson brand stuff? It's the only thing I used to use back home and would love to get my hands on some over here!

Thanks already in advance!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 15 March 2016, 06:38 PM
Bought it at dealer.

http://www.mboemparts.com/about-us
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Zaxxon on 15 March 2016, 06:38 PM
Ok, that was easy! Thanks for the info!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 11 August 2016, 11:53 AM
It's been some time since I posted an update on my car.  The end is in sight!  Got through the remove fuse box and fix rust issue and that led to restoring the brake power unit and master cylinder. The Webasto heater has been reinstalled, though it had to be loosened about 3 times to get various things right with it. The wire harness on that side of the engine bay has been cleaned and repaired.

Bled brakes, put water in radiator - only had to drain once to fix the misrouted Webasto hoses, and filled the hydraulic tank. The fuel distributor and WUR are on their way back from GermanStar after having both rebuilt. Still need to go over some stuff back by the fuel pumps to make sure things are correct there, and install the fuel pump for the Webasto.  I found a very nice original one a while back.

So looks like I am within a short time of starting the engine and seeing how the suspension works. That should be interesting to look for leaks on all the fittings I have gone through!   If all goes well I will be able to drive the car for the first time.  It has been a year already since I started work on the car. I have ordered 461 separate parts so far.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Peter on 11 August 2016, 01:51 PM
Its looking very clean on the underside.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 11 August 2016, 02:29 PM
Looking sharp there Robert ;D
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 14 August 2016, 01:25 PM
Fuel distributor arrived Saturday.  Just got done installing it.  Instructions say to connect fuel in and out together and run pump for an hour. Anyone know where and which relay it is located?  There are 3 inside my fuse box. Should I just jumper then until I find the one for the pump?  What terminals do I jump?  86 and 86?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Max-NL on 15 August 2016, 11:35 AM
If I remember correctly you could just unplug the blue connector at the airflow sensor, which allows to let the pump run with the ignition on but engine off.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 15 August 2016, 01:30 PM
Thanks, I read that also, but did not know what key position to use.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 September 2016, 10:33 AM
Finally got the spare engine out today. Biggest issue was getting the bellhousing over the tubular cross member. I think the thing to help is have your leveler set so that you can get the front of engine a lot higher than the back.  It's a tight squeeze.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Peter on 27 September 2016, 02:43 PM
I do like a nice white Mercedes either the 116 or the 108, what are you doing with the engine Rumb.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 September 2016, 02:50 PM
shoved in corner for parts or ???? (it's a euro engine)

I needed the ring gear for my car.  pulled a perfect one out of the spare engine.

Will get serious to finish stripping the white one down over the next 2 weeks and then the hulk to the scrap yard.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 20 January 2017, 05:43 AM
Motion being made, if not actual progress..

Kind of fun to see two engine together.  Stripping ever item that is to be yellow zinc plated of both engines and body. Several hundred items, taking pictures of each part removed and hardware that goes along with it. Ring gear and starter gear especially was trashed. Power washed engine yesterday, need to scrub remaining gunk off. Then swap good transmission on.

Parts arrive soon to do timing chain, valve stem seals and adjust lifter clearances.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 01 February 2017, 05:52 AM
Here's pictures of my timing chain stretch.  Looks like about 4 degrees at the crank plus right bank offset.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 01 February 2017, 05:55 AM
And here is the valve lash.  I ordered stainless shim stock .031 inch which is .78mm.   will punch circles out of it to shim with.  The gauge red measuring line is @1.5mm and you can see that I am at the bottom or just below the red line.

While there will do the seals, my mechanic lent me the MB valve stem seal installer tools!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 01 February 2017, 07:51 AM
Hey Robert.

Not sure if you know this but I was told you have to line up the timing marker to 0 on the balancer, THEN read the "error" on the cam marks.  Looks like on your pics your marker is not @ 0?  Unless I'm mistaken and perhaps there are different methods to read the stretch.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 01 February 2017, 05:26 PM
Hey Robert.

Not sure if you know this but I was told you have to line up the timing marker to 0 on the balancer, THEN read the "error" on the cam marks.  Looks like on your pics your marker is not @ 0?  Unless I'm mistaken and perhaps there are different methods to read the stretch.

Hmmm, I always thought it was the other way, as I did it. elsewise you would you be able to read how far off as there is no scale on the cams?

Either way it is obvious stretched and performance will be less in this condition.

Must do research?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 01 February 2017, 06:06 PM
Indeed perhaps your method is more accurate. From what I've read with pointer at 0 your marks on the cams must be slightly before or right on the pedestal mark. You might need offset keys to finesse that last little bit. Member "s class" has posted on this.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 02 February 2017, 01:46 AM
Correct way is to line up the right hand cam marks, then take the reading off the damper.  I'm going to guess that if you do this, you will see severe stretch, ie 15 degrees or so. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 02 February 2017, 05:37 AM
Correct way is to line up the right hand cam marks, then take the reading off the damper.  I'm going to guess that if you do this, you will see severe stretch, ie 15 degrees or so.

That makes sense as the right bank always has more stretch than the left.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 02 February 2017, 12:07 PM
I turned the crank until the right cam marks lined up and you were pretty close, it was 14 degrees off.

That far off I imagine I will feel the difference with the new chain.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Max-NL on 04 February 2017, 10:31 AM
And here is the valve lash.  I ordered stainless shim stock .031 inch which is .78mm.   will punch circles out of it to shim with.  The gauge red measuring line is @1.5mm and you can see that I am at the bottom or just below the red line.

While there will do the seals, my mechanic lent me the MB valve stem seal installer tools!

Hello Robert,

Quick question, is that a m100 test gauge or a m117 test gauge?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 04 February 2017, 11:54 AM


Hello Robert,

Quick question, is that a m100 test gauge or a m117 test gauge?
[/quote]

It is the M117, from what I have read, the m100 is nla and the M117 works just fine instead.

http://www.m-100.co/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3902

I have also read that the aftermarket ones are quite off on the dimensions so you should only use MB original  ones.

Dont know what brand these guys sell, but it cost less from the dealer

Mercedes-Benz   117 589 06 23 00   Go-no-Go Gauge. Needed for checking hydraulic valve lifters. V8 engines 100.985 , 116 and 117. This tool replaced old tool 100 589 04 23 00 and old tool number 900 589 04 23 00.  (Picture 2)
 
PayPal - The safer, easier way to pay online!   $234.9

http://www.samstagsales.com/mercedes.htm
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Max-NL on 05 February 2017, 07:47 AM
Thanks for the tip. We'll first ask around for one.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 05 February 2017, 01:30 PM
This page explains the accuracy of the aftermarket tools as well as why the PN changed.

http://www.m-100.co/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8656&whichpage=3
Title: Re: My 6.9's - exhaust manifolds
Post by: rumb on 12 February 2017, 03:16 PM
Do you think exhaust manifold gaskets can be reused?  Pulled manifolds off and the gaskets look to be in very good shape and dont appear to be compressed.  I am getting new copper nuts though.

Also plan on sandblasting the manifolds.  Any particular hi temp paint to use?  I have used hi temp clear on clean sandblasted manifolds before and it turned them a medium grey - but they stay that way and doesn't oxidize. Should I just leave them bare cast iron? or get a high temp cast iron spray paint?  any suggestions?  Is ceramic coated worth it for reducing all the temps in the engine bay?
Title: Re: My 6.9's - exhaust manifolds
Post by: ptashek on 13 February 2017, 01:39 PM
I would replace the seals gaskets. They're not super expensive, and you'll have peace of mind that nothing leaks where it's not supposed to.

As for ceramic coating the manifolds - you may remember from my restore thread I had mine coated.

(http://forum.w116.org/test-drive/the-'goldilocks'-restoration-thread/?action=dlattach;attach=4427)

The guys doing the job warned upfront that the longevity of the coating is heavily dependent on how hot the engine runs.

After a good few thousand on the autobahn since, my manifolds have turned greyish brown in places, presumably hot spots. But the coating hasn't peeled off, just discoloured.

Was it worth it? Depends on cost. Mine cost just over a 100EUR to do inside and out. I think that's reasonable for the end result.

Heat reduction wasn't really my goal, so can't say if the claims (up-to 30% reduction) made by the shop are true or not. I've never bothered checking.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 February 2017, 02:29 PM
You forget that the M100 parts are more.... :P

$105.60 for 8 exhaust gaskets.

I went ahead and ordered them after consulting with my indi.

Good news is valve guides appear in good condition and not loose.  Managed to drop an exhaust valve almost all the way into the cylinder, luckily the exhaust manifolds are off and I could get the tip of it with duct tape wrapped pliers and feed it back up through the guide! Took several hours to figure out how to use the spring compressor and everything else like getting the valve keepers out of a few stubborn ones.  Managed to stuff up a few intake stem seals so had to reorder a set of those.

Of note is they must be magnesium or stainless or something because they are not magnetic like the intake valves. I had .77mm shims water jet cut out of stainless shim stock.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: wbrian63 on 14 February 2017, 07:07 AM
If I recall correctly, the exhaust valves are sodium filled - don't know how that would affect magnetic properties...
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 14 February 2017, 08:16 AM
You forget that the M100 parts are more.... :P

$105.60 for 8 exhaust gaskets.

I went ahead and ordered them after consulting with my indi.

Good news is valve guides appear in good condition and not loose.  Managed to drop an exhaust valve almost all the way into the cylinder, luckily the exhaust manifolds are off and I could get the tip of it with duct tape wrapped pliers and feed it back up through the guide! Took several hours to figure out how to use the spring compressor and everything else like getting the valve keepers out of a few stubborn ones.  Managed to stuff up a few intake stem seals so had to reorder a set of those.

Of note is they must be magnesium or stainless or something because they are not magnetic like the intake valves. I had .77mm shims water jet cut out of stainless shim stock.

Robert, if you say the guides are not loose, do you mean not loose in the head, or the valve stem not being loose in the guide?  If both then that is fantastic news, but I have found, as have many others that this is a known weak spot of older Benzes, seems the 6.9 in particular, having the guides wear prematurely causing the valve stem being loose in the guide.  So my advice would be to really check this closely.
Title: Need 52mm original hose clamp
Post by: rumb on 21 February 2017, 05:59 AM
I need a 52mm original style hose clamp for the top thermostat hose.

Would greatly appreciate if someone had one available. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 21 February 2017, 12:49 PM
Today I replaced my timing chain, despite initial nervousness, it was really quite standard. After removing the tensioner, I used 3 narrow vicegrips to hold the chain to the sprocket. Most frustrating was those damn tiny C clips that hold the new link on, damage one, lost one completely and dropped the other 2 at least 3 times, found them on floor with my magnet.  they should really put 4-6 of them in each set. (I had two sets, very glad I did.

Split old chain, connect new and crank thru using 50mm socket on crank.

I had to fiddle and grind a bit off a 4 degree offset woodruff key to get the right bank lined up correctly.

After that I ran my finger down along the tensioner guide and felt big grooves and little bit of plastic crumbling off. I was wishfully trying to avoid that, but am pleasantly surprised how inexpensive the new ones are.  HAHA I looked the wrong ones up -  of course M100 are waaaay more. 6 rails and 3 gaskets are now $504!!! the tensioner one is $310.


2 question, 1. I dont need to order the metal backing part of the tensioner rail, just the plastic part, correct?It is a one piece on the M100 -$310!!

2. Is it advisable to do the two bottom ones?  lots of post's people dont do them,  is that just because their engine is in the car and it is a pain, or should I just go ahead with them while the engine is out of the car?

(I've done this job on my W126, so I am somewhat familiar with the process. - It took a lot of torque to get the front nut off that car. the rest wasnt that bad.

I know the bitch of this job is removing the front crank pulley - Is this really hard and/or requiring special equipment?

Here are some pictures, plated parts, cleaned up exhaust manifolds and top of engine with newly plated lines and linkages
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 21 February 2017, 02:49 PM
Hey Robert. Make sure you seat the tensioner properly. The one on the 6.9 is notorious for leaks. I used some "Form a gasket" with the paper gasket and on the advice of others applied slightly less torque on the closing plug. I think 10nm less from memory. Maybe you'll be lucky with following spec and no leaks.
Yup that nut on the pully spec is 400nm :o
Title: Re: Need 52mm original hose clamp
Post by: rumb on 23 February 2017, 12:45 PM
I need a 52mm original style hose clamp for the top thermostat hose.

Would greatly appreciate if someone had one available.

Also need two 27mm ones.

Here is a detailed picture of the 52mm one.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 23 February 2017, 12:51 PM
Front crank pulley came off reasonably well,  one pulley bolt was a bit stubborn.  The puller worked well, was a bit hard at first and then went fine.  I knocked the big nut off with my impact wrench in a few seconds.

Getting the damper back on will be a lot more challenging from what I have read.  I've done this same job on my W126 so I am pretty familiar with it at least.

Probably will take 2 weeks for parts to get here, so I can finish cleaning and painting the rest of the engine bay during that period.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: oversize on 24 February 2017, 03:55 PM
Engine porn!  WOW great job!  Where are you getting the parts?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 25 February 2017, 06:33 AM
I buy most of my parts from http://www.mbpartscenter.com/oe-mercedes-benz/1167250125

The plating I do some myself, and I just took a large batch to a local company.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 02 March 2017, 01:55 PM
Received my pin puller and got the tensioner guide out. As you can see it is crumbling on one edge.  got it just in time!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: ptashek on 02 March 2017, 04:36 PM
Wow, that is nasty! What's the mileage on that chain?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 02 March 2017, 05:33 PM
Hard to say, the odo stopped working in 1991 at about 86K miles.  The car lived in Nevada and was subject to high heat most of it's life.

BTW  here is the pin puller I got,  it works very well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mercedes-Chain-Rail-Pin-Puller-Engine-Timing-Tools-/122357090695

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 25 March 2017, 06:59 AM
Took my driveshaft to get balanced because when I removed it from the car, the 2 shafts accidentally  got separated.  They said they could not balance it because the splines were too worn.  I did notice the big nut was somewhat loose before i removed it.

anyway my spare shaft seems tight there, so new center bearing and support ordered.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: UTn_boy on 29 March 2017, 08:35 AM
It's funny.....I STILL have people that tell me I'm wasting my time replacing timing chain and chain rails at 100,000 mile intervals.  I suppose the joke is on them, huh?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 29 March 2017, 09:52 AM
It's funny.....I STILL have people that tell me I'm wasting my time replacing timing chain and chain rails at 100,000 mile intervals.  I suppose the joke is on them, huh?

On other forum someone was adamant that chain never had to be replaced because there was no specific literature that said to replace it every X miles. Insisted that you should just keep changing offset cam keys.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 29 March 2017, 12:06 PM
Until KABOOM! Like cholesterol, the silent killer :o unless you count the timing chain "death rattle " which I'm sure most folks ignore.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 06 April 2017, 01:53 PM
There engine is back together with all it's new plated parts, new timing chain and guides, valve stem seals and valves adjusted.

Just painted engine bay today, next week will respray undercoating on bottom of car, rebuild driveshaft and start assembly.

First picture is what I started with..


*somehow the images are reversed - not a new engine configuration!!!


Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 06 April 2017, 01:59 PM
more shots
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 06 April 2017, 09:32 PM
Looking good Robert 8)!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: floyd111 on 06 April 2017, 11:42 PM
Fantastic! ;D
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: beagle2022 on 07 April 2017, 12:01 AM
Wow!  Wonderful job.  Congratulations.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Peter on 07 April 2017, 02:25 PM
Very nice  ;D
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 20 April 2017, 02:22 PM
OK, need help figuring out where a couple of parts go.

First is this aluminum exhaust heat shield.  cant find in epc.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 20 April 2017, 02:27 PM
next,  the clip on clamp on the side of the power brake. what is is suppose to hold down?  I just put the fuel lines through it and they fit pretty well, but when I took the clip off originally there was nothing under it. 

The lower red circle, there was a yellow zinc clamp with a bolt hole on both ends to hold the fuel lines down.  dont remember if there was a rubber piece there or not, but I dont think so as the large protective tubing on the fuel lines would disallow them. the fuel line on the right is a new one and it didnt come with the protective sleeve like the old one.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 20 April 2017, 02:39 PM
Here is a picture of the underside of car with new undercoat. - 3m brand.  no problem with peeling. Wonder how long it will stay that nice color after driving?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 04 May 2017, 10:20 AM
Started engine today after all the work done to it and engine bay! with no exhaust on it sure sound healthy!

The heater control valve on firewall that I took from the parts car is leaking...it's one of the plastic ones. there was a water leak on top of water pump that hopefully sealed itself.   ;D

Can someone please post a photo of where the engine ground strap is suppose to attach to the chassis?  I cant seem to find any hole that would make a connection point.  for the time being I attached it to the idler arm bushing post as that was the only hole I could find that the strap reached, but I dont really think that is correct.

Got old bushing out of front lower control arms, waiting for parts,  and then will have to figure out how to get them in.

In the previous posted pictures I found where the extra heat shield goes, but could use confirmation about the clip on the master brake unit that I think holds the fuel lines.

I was hoping to drive it to a MBCA event next weekend, but looks like I may miss that chance.  :-\

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 04 May 2017, 11:00 AM
Hey Robert yes that clip on the booster holds both the feed and return fuel hoses.
Title: Re: My 6.9
Post by: rumb on 20 May 2017, 10:40 AM
sooooo close.

Got front suspension completed, bled brakes, connected hydro pump line to regulator and fired it up. 

Huge leak from rebuilt hydro pump. I must of messed up the sealing o-ring.  At least the hydro light turned off rather quickly on the dash.

Next couple of days will pull the pump and see what I did wrong.


Wednesday we are headed to Wilsonville OR, to pick up our "new" 2014 CLS550!  Then a nice road trip back home.






Title: Re: My 6.9
Post by: daantjie on 20 May 2017, 10:53 AM
sooooo close.

Got front suspension completed, bled brakes, connected hydro pump line to regulator and fired it up. 

Huge leak from rebuilt hydro pump. I must of messed up the sealing o-ring.  At least the hydro light turned off rather quickly on the dash.

Next couple of days will pull the pump and see what I did wrong.


Wednesday we are headed to Wilsonville OR, to pick up our "new" 2014 CLS550!  Then a nice road trip back home.

Robert a good check for a rebuild is to block inlet and try and pull a vacuum into the feed side. If you cannot pull and hold 30 inHg of vacuum then you have a leaky pump.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 22 May 2017, 10:51 AM
took hydro pump apart and couldnt really find anything, perhaps a bit of dirt or there may have been a rub on the outer o-ring.  Anyway got that back in and is working fine now.

After tightening the drive shaft coupler nut I took the car out for a quick test run this morning. -  of course with no exhaust!

All I can say is "WOW"  what a difference the timing chain and valve adjust did. Went from rather ho-hum to a kick in the pants! If you recall  my right cam was 20 degrees off.

I was short radiator fluid so engine got hot so I took it easy back home and added over a gallon of fluid.  Now it appear my radiator leaks, or hopefully it was just the top hose clamp.  Will have to watch that one close.  Also small leak from one of the tranny pan bolts.  tightened a tiny bit, but I dont want to overtighten them either. This is the swapped in trans. 

Also no speedometer, that worked before.  If it is not just getting the shaft lined up what is involved in replacing what ever drives it in the tranny?



Trying to seal up various little leaks everywhere now.  I think the lid on the power steering pump leaks, lost a good bit of fluid from somewhere in that area.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: oversize on 23 May 2017, 07:59 PM
Got any video?  Looks fantastic!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 30 July 2017, 09:51 AM
Well, one step forward, one step back.  After spending 2.5 months working on my hydro pump, due to ordering incorrect parts, ordering parts and ordering parts again because I screwed up the 2nd order, then being on vacation for 3 weeks , I finally reassembled the pump  and put back on.  Good news that at least idle speed it does not  leak. I had got the car to rise and was checking again under the hood when the engine just stopped and I saw gas leaking from the main fuel line to the FD.  Discovered that the new rubber line I had a shop crimp on some time ago had just torn completely off at the crimp connection.

I recall him using SAE hose and fittings, they must be the wrong size as it completely tore the hose off.  Better sitting in the garage then out on the road though.

Well, off to source some metric materials.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 30 July 2017, 03:42 PM
www.belmetric.com is you friend for all metric goodies ;)
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 31 July 2017, 06:04 AM
www.belmetric.com is you friend for all metric goodies ;)

Yes, they seem to have the materials, but who has the $1500 crimping tool?

I found a local mobile industrial hose service that may be able to tackle the project, they at least say they have metric hoses. Need to call them up and discuss.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: floyd111 on 01 August 2017, 12:09 AM
Hat's off to your stamina!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: nathan on 01 August 2017, 06:17 AM
Heh Rum,
sorry i missed your post.
this looks like the drivers side (thats RHS!!) shield on the firewall. you can see it pictured on my car with it on, with it off, and an example of its partner shield on the left side ( i dont have a pic of it on the RHS). flip it round and see if it fits!
regards
nathan
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 01 August 2017, 10:09 AM
Actually I did figure it out, it screws onto the back end  of one of the under car shields.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 26 August 2017, 11:37 AM
Well after 3 months, 4 times ordering parts, and 6 rebuild attempts I have a sealed hydro pump.  Came to realize the inside of the pump body was badly dinged especially where the oring sits.  I thing it may have been damaged trying to remove the pump from the inside, it was a ver tight fit even with heating the body with  torch.  I used the body from my spare and used the old pump and the new crankshaft as the two designs are slightly different.

I spent 1 hours tightening the nut on the power steering pump adjuster.  what a pain! 1/32 of a turn with each wrench application!

Works greats, drove about 50km with no issues there.

Now onto an issue with a bit of overheating.  car runs in the 105-110C temp range.  Any advice here? I suppose having the radiator boiled and checked would be a good start.  any special tricks to burping they system?

At least I can drive the car now, but not ready for a long road trip until I get it to run a bit cooler.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 26 August 2017, 11:41 AM
Robert usually parking on a steep incline with nose high will allow you to burp air from the system by opening and closing the cap on the expansion tank in short intervals with engine running.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 26 August 2017, 11:45 AM
Also since my AC is not functional, is there a way to jumper the temp switch to turn the fan on permanent?  where is the switch located?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 26 August 2017, 12:41 PM
The 212 switch connects on the thermostat housing. If you ground the switch it will make the fan run all the time.
AC fan switch connects on the dryer assembly on the front of the car.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: UTn_boy on 26 August 2017, 10:29 PM
Rumb, you can't run that fan permanently......well, technically you can. What I'm driving at is that at any speeds above about 15 MPH the fan isn't needed because the air flowing over the condenser and radiator at that speed and higher are equal to what the electric fan will do at low speeds.  Consequently, operating the fan at speeds above 15 MPH will do two things. 1) More air will be going through the fan than designed to do so, which will quickly damage your electric fan motor, and 2) because of reason number 1, air flow will be decreased over the condenser and radiator at high speeds causing the engine to run hotter.  If you have hot running problems, then there is a problems somewhere that you must address.  Clogged radiator, clogged coolant passages in the engine block or cylinder heads, an incorrectly assembled or defective water pump, or maybe even a defective thermostat. 

....Which brings me to another issue to put out on the table....why in the hell is a 6.9 thermostat (part number 100-200-06-15) so damned expensive?!  Here in the U.S., it retails for $284, and wholesales for $198.80.  The substitute people have been using is a 110-200-05-15, and it's very affordable at $54/$37.  While it works, I have to wonder if the operating temperatures are the same between the two, and if not, how can we find/use a thermostat that has the originally intended operating temperature without having to fall victim to Mercedes's price gouging? 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 26 August 2017, 10:37 PM
Aaron raises a good point in that I recall the service manual is very particular with regards to correct thermostat operation in that it specifically mentions (from memory) 4 different modes of operation during each temp range. You may not be getting full coolant flow due to an incorrect part and/or incorrect operation.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 August 2017, 07:07 AM
 I will testing in a pot of hot water today to see if that is the issue.
(crap- just remembered I sold my other thermostat housing with a spare thermostat in it)

Thanks for the warning about running the fan.

Steep incline burping did not change things.

I have a spare radiator that I will take down to be re cored or rebuilt. After I install the rebuilt I will prob get the other rebuilt and keep for future.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 August 2017, 10:17 AM
hot water test of thermostat pulled from car. it is a behr 2 082 79, stamped 79C degrees.  It opened at about 82 degrees and when fully open the gap was @1/4" around the center disc.

Is opening too soon not good?  "We also in some circumstances may experience overheating if flow through the system is too high as the coolant has to spend a certain amount of time in the radiator to actually cool down."

I guess I will order the MB one  87C degrees . 110-200-05-15, and rebuild the radiator.

I dont seem to remember the car getting this hot the 50 or so miles I drove the car before I pulled the engine. Maybe I swapped thermostats with the other one I had, but dont remember.


There was water covering the thermostat in the housing, but not much water in the upper radiator hose, is this normal when the engine is cold?

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 27 August 2017, 11:28 AM
Indeed every time I have pulled the rad hose water was right at the top of thermostat with cold motor.  Must be the only thing on this motor that is easily accessible  ;D
Brand on mine in Wahler. Not sure if that is OEM. On ebay you can get one for like 25 bucks.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: UTn_boy on 28 August 2017, 08:27 AM
If you're worried about air being in the system, then make sure your heater valve is open, and after you top off the coolant, unscrew one of the temperature sensors in the top of the intake manifold.  If there is air in the system it'll burp out here, as air rises to the top anyway.  Be sure to squeeze the lower radiator hose, too; 3-4 long slow squeezes. (before unscrewing temp sensors)  This will purge any air out that is trapped below the top surface.  While doing all of this, make sure that your expansion tank cap is removed to allow for breathing.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 04 September 2017, 05:31 AM
Just found this product. Looks like it eliminates any air pockets in your cooling system.

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-schwaben-parts/coolant-refill-air-purge-tool/003466sch01/
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 September 2017, 04:15 PM
newly recored radiator is suppose to be back in a few day. thought I would test my 2 old fan clutches.

I heated both with a hot air gun to @200 degrees and felt no difference in the amount of force needed to turn the hub.  both were mildly firm the entire time and I did not feel any stiffening. one almost felt easier.

Now the next new problem.  my engine is 002050 which epc says A0002000722 is for up to engine 005888  the notes say you can use the  later, but you have to replace the water pump with 100 200 32 01, which of course aint going to happen. I cant seem to find that clutch anywhere.

005888 on uses A1162000522

does the later one fit the newer engines?

one of my 2 clutches is 116 200 01 22 (1st substitution in epc) , which is easily available in a variety of brands.  Since I know that fits, I may just get one of those. I can get a behr brand for $129 or a MB one (05 22) for $399.

I went out and measured the 2 I have and the critical dimensions are the same.






Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 15 September 2017, 07:23 AM
I'm probably going to be shown up wrong, but Ive been using the inexpensive 116 200 05 22 from Behr on all manner of 116/107/126 for some time now.  They fit just fine.  There may be some differences in stiffness spec between the different clutches, but I maintain that a new unit of possibly incorrect spec is still better than the old worn out unit.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: TJ 450 on 16 September 2017, 09:43 PM
You could even use W126 units if you want, I've used whole 560 fan assemblies on both of my cars and they work well. My understanding is that most clutches have been changed out to the types used on the 450 M117s by now, which are no doubt incorrect spec. The ones originally used on the 6.9s from what I can tell were quite different in appearance with a very square profile to the fins.

Tim
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 19 September 2017, 11:49 AM
Just recieved the new fan clutch.  it is way more stiff than the old ones to turn. Received 87 degree thermostat also.  now all I need is the radiator.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 04 October 2017, 02:58 PM
I think I may have finished this one finally.  Had to get a new overflow tank as the old one cracked, then wait 2 weeks for the plug (from Germany) since the new one if from a W126  and it has a level sensor hole that has to be plugged. you also have to adapt the main hose as the new tank has a bigger fitting. 1/2" copper coupling inside old hose, old hose inside new hose and clamp.

recore radiator - original MB Behr tank!
new fan clutch
new thermostat
new overflow tank

Seems to be setting at 90 degrees now!  That's just a test in the garage, still need a road test.

Now need to pull trans pan and install new gasket with non hardening sealer on the gasket to pan side. plus I'm swapping the one off my other trans that I know didnt leak before.
Title: the good, the bad, the ugly
Post by: rumb on 06 October 2017, 10:53 AM
Went on a 80 mile road trip to Cheyenne WY this morning. Hit and easy 100mph for a short distance. very smooth.  5300 ft elevation up to 6000'.  car ran at 98 degrees steady. I guess that is pretty good. Dont seem to be leaking anything, though I need to go out later and double check.

Unfortunate about 15 miles from home my left rear wheel fell off! Guess I didnt torque that one?   Hagerty Insurance, got towed home.  damaged the wheel, lost lug nuts, bent upper rear bumper and did a mild number on the rear fender.  car dragged on the anti dive link mostly, some scrapping on the lower A arm. bent brake backing plate.   I'm guessing $1500-2000 damages, of which a lot of I have replacement parts and I may be able to get my body shop to fix some of the rust on the rear fender as part of it.

Need to figure out all the MB parts needed and cost.  I know replacing that link is a bugger that a MB shop may have to do, but it needed replacing anyway.   All in all I may come out slightly ahead by the time it is done.

I did learn that my tool kit has 2 spark plugs sockets and no lug bolt wrench! 

car drove very well on three wheels.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 06 October 2017, 11:10 AM
Holy cow :o  Good thing that wheel did not come off @ 100 mph, otherwise you would not be here typing this message my friend ;D  Yup those anti - squat parts are pricey as hell if you can still find them.  I think I saw some on ebay.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: nathan on 06 October 2017, 04:20 PM
a wheel fell off?!?!
come on, I want to see a pic, thats crazy!
least you didn't slide off the road and do more damage to the car or yourself
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: slfan on 06 October 2017, 04:35 PM
.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: floyd111 on 06 October 2017, 04:37 PM
Guess the silver lining here is that we now know it'll drive on 3 wheels.  ;)
Quite a streak of bad luck there, hope it won't end up too costly.
Post the part numbers and (your) prices here if you want. Maybe there's members here that can help finding them (cheaper)
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: karmann_20v on 06 October 2017, 07:01 PM
Morale of the (wheel falling off) story: W116 is not made by Citroen! Glad to hear it wasn't worse.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: ptashek on 07 October 2017, 04:22 AM
What's important, you're OK. The car can be fixed.

My dad and I had a wheel fall off once, driving an Audi 80 Quattro on the autobahn, at 80km/h. The wheel went under the car, turning it into a flying saucer for a split second. Then it was a hard landing, belly down luckily.

I make a big fuss about checking all wheel bolts regularly since then.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 07 October 2017, 04:54 AM
thanks for your concerns.  I always attempt to correctly tighten every bolt when I install it. not put in loose and go back later.  at my  age I try  and make things fool proof, but this time I must be the fool. somehow I must of forgotten to torque that wheel wheel I put the new set on.  First time in 50 years wrenching I make that mistake.  :o

parts required:
108 400 10 02   wheel  NLA  - a very nice one on ebay
107-350-05-38   caliper bracket   NLA - one one ebay
126-401-06-70   5 lug bolts
   fender patch panel ?
116-730-03-80   side molding LR door
107-420-04-44   brake shield  - I have
116-880-07-71   upper rear bumper  - I have
126-352-04-04   lower cntrl arm RL  NLA  - I have

Look like I either have the extra part myself or I see them on ebay available.

Will probably need a Mercedes mechanic and the body shop.

At 82 mph, I was in left lane and was very easy to steer over to shoulder.  I saw the wheel pass me rolling down the shoulder.  took a while to find as there was a ditch with cat tails and about 12" of water.  wheel bolt hole are elongated and big groove cut in inside.

I wonder if dragging car like that would have put anything out of alignment on left rear suspension areas?


Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 07 October 2017, 05:12 AM
Looks like I need this spark plug wrench handle.  I have the socket part.

100-581-00-67

need part circled in red, or entire if that's what it takes?  anyone have this?


I found a lug wrench on fleabay for cheap.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: TJ 450 on 08 October 2017, 04:37 AM
That's quite unfortunate, I made that mistake once before as well but got to it before the wheel fell off. I needed a new hub though!

FWIW all these parts are the same as on the W126 with anti squat rear end, it maybe easier to get the whole trailing arm assembly with wheel carrier and swap it out with the subframe dropped if you can.

Tim
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 08 October 2017, 05:41 AM
So back to question that may have got lost in conversation.  Do you think 98C is acceptable running temperature?

I keep squeezing the lower radiator hose.  I know there must be water in there, but it hardly feels like it.  It is very easy to squeeze. I heard air gets trapped in that hose?  If so how do you get the air out?



Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: TJ 450 on 08 October 2017, 08:56 AM
The upper hose usually has air in it, but I don't find it causes any issues in practice. Around 100C you would likely see on a hot day in stop- start traffic or higher ambient temps at highway speeds, so it depends on how you're using the car. Also after hot soak, but it should drop in once coolant circulates.

My blue car generally ran at 80-90C, silver one at 90-100 with original radiator.

Otherwise, I would just drive the car and monitor.

Tim
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 08 October 2017, 10:47 AM
I would tend to agree with Tim.  Trying to chase a few degrees on the gauge is folly in my opinion. These motors tend to run a bit hot.  Unless you go up and stay in the red I would not worry too much.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 10 October 2017, 11:40 AM
Any ideas on how I can get this shipped to me in the USA and not cost a fortune?

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Mercedes-W116-280S-280SE-350SE-450SE-450SEL-Kotflugel-hinten-1166370109-/132355290298?hash=item1ed0fd74ba:g:FusAAOSwKytZFMD8


trans global freight wants $1449!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: ptashek on 10 October 2017, 11:54 AM
Any ideas on how I can get this shipped to me in the USA and not cost a fortune?

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Mercedes-W116-280S-280SE-350SE-450SE-450SEL-Kotflugel-hinten-1166370109-/132355290298?hash=item1ed0fd74ba:g:FusAAOSwKytZFMD8


trans global freight wants $1449!

Find someone who is flying business class somewhere near you, and could take it as part of their checked baggage.
I think the dashboard I sold to s-class traveled in similar fashion from UK to South Africa.

If it were two weeks ago, I could have brought it over for you :(
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 10 October 2017, 12:17 PM
Try Deutsche Post/DHL " freight" and not "express".
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 10 October 2017, 03:29 PM
I looked it up, I can fly there and pick it up myself for less than that~ :P
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: nathan on 10 October 2017, 04:21 PM
thats a lot! Fedex with classic centre only charges 250US for 4 alloys!!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: slfan on 11 October 2017, 02:09 AM
Scary situation.  Glad that you did not get hurt.  Will start paying more to my lug bolts.

Good luck repairing the car.

Regards
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 11 October 2017, 05:16 AM
I found a repo 1/4 panel at adsitco for $895 plus shipping.  Funny they sell  repo for more than original MB parts....and yeah, I know adsitco's reputation already.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 12 October 2017, 01:42 PM
Hagerty is sending me a check for $8,582.06

Interesting they wont pay for the wheel and lug bolts as "that was the part that caused the accident".

Some may bitch about hagerty valuations, but I'm damn glad I was insured to $17,000.  After I fix things I will raise it further.

I plan of using a patch panel and doing all the work myself, so I have a full winter's work ahead.......I have a lot of rust down there anyway that needs repaired.  Just fixing it a bit sooner than I planned.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 19 October 2017, 08:32 AM
Found a second  new SHACKLE, CTRL.ARM to ANCHOR SUPPORT 107-350-05-38 at http://exoparts.com/mercedes-benz-parts-list-2/









Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 19 October 2017, 09:46 AM
Webasto installation manual (in German)
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 22 January 2018, 03:48 PM
After taking a break and rebuilding the front suspension and driveshaft on my 300SE, changing the trans fluid in SL500 and a bunch of other stuff I'm back at the 6.9 again. 

Got the door locks to work last week and today I removed all the wood and packed to send to ReInvent the Wheel

http://www.dieselmercedes.com/Mercedes_Complete_Wood_Trim_Set_Restoration_Servic_p/5210-w16-r.htm Good price, I hope the quality is there.

I had a large store credit due to a previous transaction gone bad, but they made is all good with a large store credit.

Only took about 3 hours to get all the wood removed, much easier the 2nd time around! The far left one is the worst as there is no good access to it.  I taped a whatever size it is socket onto the end of a stubby 2" regular screwdriver, pushed the air vent hose out of the way (after removing the speedo cluster) and then it was really pretty easy to get that last nut out.

Will work on stripping interior of car the rest of the week.

Have been waiting 4 weeks now for the swede to send me an invoice in the mail for the Webasto part.  Been working on that for at least 3 months now.  boy are they sloooooow.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: UTn_boy on 23 January 2018, 03:23 PM
I hope they drilled a hole in the large dash piece for your height control knob.  I also hope they realize that there are a total of 3 different backings used on W116 dash wood.  It all depends on which dash you have.  There were two different dash profiles behind the wood before 1976.  After 1976 there was yet a third style. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 24 January 2018, 06:14 AM
They refinish the pieces that your send them.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 24 January 2018, 01:41 PM
My local indy has retired but loaned me his vacuum tester! 116 589 25 2100.

 found a bad valve in drivers door with it.

Cruise control actuator holds vac.
heater valve works correctly
Door locks work better.
+++
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 24 January 2018, 02:59 PM
crisp part!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: UTn_boy on 25 January 2018, 01:29 AM
They refinish the pieces that your send them.

Oh good.  I was so upset that a company would offer "wood kits" for these cars that had no idea what they were doing. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 February 2018, 11:47 AM
Let the fun begin!

Got car on jack stands and started removing rocker panel. As you can see the jack point was completely rotted off the bracket. This seems to be a bit of jigsaw puzzle to figure out where to cut each piece.

As the wise man said, how do you eat an elephant? one bite at a time.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 13 February 2018, 11:50 AM
lots of rust  >:(
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 25 February 2018, 07:11 AM
This week's progress.  got all old panels off, straightened, and rust areas cut out. fitted front section of inner rocker, and make patch panel to fill in front area.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 25 February 2018, 07:13 AM
Have 2 complete sets of garnish mouldings, getting ready to send out for replating.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 25 February 2018, 07:21 AM
working on possibly reproducing front and rear jack points.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: marku on 25 February 2018, 07:58 AM
I really do admire your commitment to the car.  But that is the only way to know it doing it yourself. When you have put every last nut and bolt on personally you can't beat that knowledge or even the just the pleasure of the achievement. Great work.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Squiggle Dog on 25 February 2018, 06:32 PM
Wow, this is getting good! Those plans for the jack points are impressive.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 26 February 2018, 01:28 AM
Well done that some very nice quick progress.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: Ub2693v on 04 April 2018, 06:21 PM
The blue interior on your parts car, is it cloth or leather? If cloth I’d be interested in the rear shelf where the first aid kit is, maybe rear seat back as well.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 05 April 2018, 10:32 AM
The blue interior on your parts car, is it cloth or leather? If cloth I’d be interested in the rear shelf where the first aid kit is, maybe rear seat back as well.

Sorry that's all gone now. the rear shelf was worthless and the rear seats had split. I have the 2 front seats still, fairly worn but I can look at them if you want.

PM me.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 20 April 2018, 01:58 PM
Got some time to do more work. front corner patch welded in and rear jack point rust cut out and patch welded in.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 29 April 2018, 05:46 PM
Finally received my wood back from refinishing
http://www.dieselmercedes.com/Mercedes_Complete_Wood_Trim_Set_Restoration_Servic_p/5210-w16-r.htm

Overall the finish is very nice, but not perfect. perhaps a 98% rating,  There are a few minute spots and the top of the climate control panel the finish is not smooth, though it would be hard to notice when installed.  Other than that I am very pleased with the work. The gloss is very flat and smooth surface, thick coating and very good color.  The cost is about 1/2 of Madera Concepts, so I am quite happy excusing the few minor specs.

The sellers site list 1-2 weeks that I never believed in the first place and it took 3 months instead.  They did let me know about some of the delay due to high humidity where the work was being done.

Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 30 April 2018, 05:05 AM
That does look nice indeed.

Version 1 : THe earliest cars had black vinyl shifter surround, and climate control panel. 
Version 2 : The later cars had full burl wood. 

My #1670 has a full complment of zebrano, like yours.  I have always maintained that it is original to the car, call it version 1.5.  The wisdom of the M100 group shouted me down, saying the cars were only eithert version 1 or 2, so I feel a bit vindicated now.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 30 April 2018, 05:50 AM
I agree the Zebrano is so much nicer than the black vinyl.  As much of an original purist that I am, I consider this a tasteful upgrade with authentic parts.


So if the early had black and the later burl, then where did all the zebrano center console wood come from?
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 30 April 2018, 07:36 AM
Rumb, what is your VIN?  I don't have exact VIN splits, but all the cars I've seen in the approx #1500 to #3000 range have full zebrano. 

IN short :
My belief is :
early cars (< approx #1500) had the horizontal zebrano strip on the dash, but black console and climate control panel (non-6.9 116's of the same era were similarly equipped)

mid cars (approx #1500 to #3000) had full zebrano (non 6.9 116's got the same upgrade around the same time)

late cars (approx >#3000) had full burl wood.  (this was a 6.9 only feature).
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: daantjie on 30 April 2018, 09:12 AM
To my knowledge all US bound cars (1977 onwards) had leather and burlwood, no exceptions.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 30 April 2018, 11:41 AM
My vin is 1951, an euro car. 2nd car off assembly  line in 1977. It came with black center console.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 08 May 2018, 04:48 AM
My vin is 1951, an euro car. 2nd car off assembly  line in 1977. It came with black center console.

Well then that starts to disprove my theory.  Mine is an earlier car (1670) that I thought had full zebrano from the factory.  Of course, the shifter surround and climate control panel could have been retrofitted by someone at a later date. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 08 May 2018, 08:57 AM
You got me thinking,  I was partially incorrect.  #1951 had a black climate control and a zebrano shifter surround and ashtray.


did someone switch it before me?  anything is possible.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 09 May 2018, 04:05 AM
I suspect your car originally had black shifter surround and ashtray as well.  I've frequently seen hybrid setups like yours, which occur because the shifter surround and ashtray are so much easier to replace than the climate control panel.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: s class on 09 May 2018, 04:06 AM
Oh, and further confirmation is your webasto control panel.  They also switched to zebrano when the shifter surround switched to zebrano. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 09 May 2018, 07:45 AM
So now I need to get a $400 webasto holder to complete the look...... :P
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 08 August 2018, 12:17 PM
Just an update.  I kind of stalled out on the sheet metal work, and then had major surgery in June which took pretty much until just a few weeks ago to recover from.  All is well now.

I did purchase a 300SEL 6.3 parts car and have been taking it apart for the last month and have just a couple weeks more to go on that. It has been a good diversion. Parts are listed on fleabay.

I also have just started collecting parts to rebuild the engine in my W108 and plan on sending the original block out to be checked and measured. I put a factory short block in the car over 30 years ago and have saved the original block all along, now it gets to go back in!

This week I disassembled my spare rear 6.9 axle assembly and have been figuring out what parts are needed to replace the LSD clutches and the seals.  The diff  side seals for the axles seem to be NLA so have to figure that one out......

The rear lower control arms I have read up on how to take those apart and spent a while reading the manual.  of course MB had about a dozen special tool they used.  I will make a few myself and see how far that gets me.  I just plan on replacing the seals, but not the races and bearings.  Everything has to come apart so the big parts can be beadblasted and painted.

The rear axles I am taking down to Denver CVJ axles they will rebuild the original ones for $178 each.  At some point I will take my 2nd set down also and get rebuilt.


Saturday the MBCA club is driving to Leadville Colo.  Should be a nice day trip.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leadville%2C_Colorado
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 26 December 2018, 02:30 PM
Not my 6.9, but my W108. Original short block has been bored and new pistons and all new parts installed. Removed existing engine from car today. Will get the head off shortly and to the shop for rebuild.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 12 May 2019, 07:22 AM
After many life delays have finally been working on the 6.9 again!  Got the rear axle removed and I am bead blasting the final parts to get down to plater. Combining W108 engine parts with remainder of 6.9 parts. I had previously disassembled the axle from my parts car. In the picture note the spare wheels attached - you never want to place the brake backing plates on the floor with the heavy suspension components attached. You will bend these NLA plates and they are very hard to straighten.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 22 May 2019, 12:18 PM
Finally got all bolts and parts off 6.9 that need yellow zinc plated and took them down to Denver today. Also dropped off axles at CVJ Axles for rebuild.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 18 June 2019, 01:41 PM
Today I refinished the anti-squat components of the rear suspension.  De-grease, mask bearing surfaces with duct tape, bead blast, polish all bearing surfaces with crocus cloth, remask for painting, and paint. Note the tooling I had made to get this assembly apart. Mine were very stubborn to get apart.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 18 June 2019, 01:45 PM
Here is some of the hardware from the plating company.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 25 June 2019, 02:16 PM
Finally had dry weather here and got the pressure tank sand blaster out.  Cleaned up the rear axle subframe and the the rear lower control arms.  Exhaust manifold from W108. Will try to paint them all tomorrow.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 27 June 2019, 06:00 PM
Subframe and lower control arms painted with Eastwood ceramic chassis black.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 25 July 2019, 11:38 AM
Installing the stub axle is one tough job! There are 5 bearings, 4 races and 3 seals. Everything in this rear axle assy it tough to get apart and tough to get together. Make several tools and bought several pullers including a 10 ton hydraulic one to get the big bearing out. The crush washer is very tough, a 5' breaker bar did nothing so I used the big impact wrench to slowly tighten with checking end play about 15 times.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 26 July 2019, 11:19 AM
Installed new link with home made alignment jig I made before I took the old ones off. There is one for each side to get the angle correct when you press the big pin in.

Fill cavity with grease and tighten nut to correct torque, install grease cap. 
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: G Johnson on 15 August 2019, 11:30 AM
Rumb
This is a very helpful post, I need to do this to my C126 can I ask how you removed the gold colour shackle/link
from the trailing arm?
The alignment jig and pulling it in with threaded bar and washers is clear I just wonder how best to remove it
Thank you for any help and tips
Graeme Johnson
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 15 August 2019, 02:13 PM
I used a small 2 jaw puller. the hook part has to be small to fit in behind the link.  I put a C clamp on to keep it from slipping off.

I think it was this one - check the sizes offered.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071DF2ZB4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

There are two alignment guides, one for each side. Make them before you pull the links off or you wont know how to install them. Use fine thread all-thread. I used coarse thread and completely pulled the threads off it. It take a lot of pressure to get them back on.

If you are replacing all the bearing, be warned that they are all stuborn. This rear axle assembly has been the hardest thing to do in 50 years of wrenching. PM me if you want any additional information. As mentioned I had several press tools made and had to purchase a 10 ton hydraulic puller to get some of it apart. I would rent them to you if needed.
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: G Johnson on 18 August 2019, 03:34 AM
Rumb
Thank you for the reply that makes sense
I would love to do mine properly and brake it down into individual parts
to blast and powder coat like you have but I know I would not be able
to re assemble the rear hub and bearing carrier.
I am just going to remove the trailing arm and paint strip wire brush and
sand with the parts assembled then paint with por 15
Thanks again Graeme Johnson (UK)
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: oversize on 13 September 2019, 02:53 AM
WOW love your work!!
Title: Re: My 6.9's
Post by: rumb on 16 September 2019, 01:45 PM
Spent the last week refinishing 4 Bundt wheels. Started with bead blasting them last week.  Applied primer and a few days later (today) sprayed the silver and clear coats. I spent 10-12 hours total time.  I suspended the wheels from a rope tied around the middle so I could get to both sides and hung them from my parts tree.  With all the holes and sides of the ribs it was quite a chore to apply the base and clear coats evenly on all surfaces.