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My first post here, despite having had a W116 280 in the past. I am a long (long!) time member of the MBOC (UK), and have been on the Heckflosse mailing list for years.

We recently moved from the UK to NZ, and I'm looking for a toy car. A lucky conversation pointed me to a blue 1979 6.9.

It has had the worst last 15 years any 6.9 could have had - it has been in storage. These cars need to be used! (That much I do know.)

It started fairly readily but is running, in the words of the current owner, "full rich". K-jets are notorious for running rich when cold but I get the impression this is worse than that - any thoughts? An issue with old vacuum lines, perhaps?

The suspension did pump up when the engine was run (it had unsurprisingly sunk over 15 years of non-use) but how good it is, and how long it'll hold pressure is another matter.

On the up side, the body appears to be in very good condition - a very quick and frankly cursory once-over didn't show any rust. Even the chrome looks good. Interior is velour which initially disappointed me, but if the contemporary reports can be believed, this may be a good thing as (apparently) the leather seats could be hard and even uncomfortable.

Even the tyres have held air for 15 years, although I suspect they'll have flat-spotted and/or perished.

I'm looking at this as a car which will be used regularly, and can be taken on as a running project. I have no pretensions at being the world's greatest mechanic (although I am generally capable) and don't plan to turn this into a concours, dehumidified storage, garage queen!

Here's some pics to whet appetites:


Incidentally, has anyone else noticed there are 116 pages of posts in the 'Mechanicals' section?  :)

Wow, you're a lucky man. It looks very good. Yes, its going to need work, but, buy it, if you haven't already.

I think it has the potential to be a good 'un... Sadly (for me) the seller has been listening to some very bad people (in my biased opinion ;)) and has listed the car online, so it looks as though I will have some purchasing competition.

I need to do some market research and try to ascertain what this is actually worth, both to the market and to me.

.

It sits a little low, so first check (as has been recommended to me elsewhere) will be the '5th sphere' in the left front wheel well.

Unless the distribution head has been damaged (and given the air filter has been removed, this is possible) the running rich issue could be a simple problem.

Which leaves a solid, complete car that requires recommissioning. Itself not necessarily an easy matter, or one to be undertaken lightly, but less of an issue than extensive body and chassis work.

I hope...  ::) :)

And while spares are likely to be in short supply in NZ, at least I won't get stung for duty when importing them from the US, Oz or Germany. Cue Monty Python music: "Always look on the bright si-ide of life..."

Rust free is a very good place to start.  I see its the high compression euro spec engine which is great. 

It looks like a good project to me... It looks like at has a good interior, and if the body is sound it's ideal. And yes, high comp is always good IMO.
I'd pounce on it.

Tim

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Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 15 August 2012, 07:01 AM
i was wondering how the hell you knew it was high compression just from the photo, but then some legacy knowledge surfaced again when i saw the engine oil cooler  ::)

I'd wondered the same thing and gone off to see if I could find out!

A closer inspection is planned for Saturday. The seller currently has an offer of NZ$3000.

If you don't buy it I will!!!!!  LOL!  Nah not really...

Welcome to the ORG!!  Could you be our one n only from NZ???

WOW that's a good car there!  Yes I too noticed the oil cooler straight away.  How's the km!!!!  Could they be genuine?  Books??  Little to no rust; OMG!!!  My question would be why was it left for 15 years if it was a going concern??

Even if the suspension is toast, it's still a good buy.  If you wanna check it anyway, make sure there's enough hydro fluid in the reservior.  If the fluid's low, the car won't pump up fully.  Once pumped up you can quickly push down a couple of times on each corner of the car and see how it responds.  It should behave like normal shockers and not oscillate more than 1.5 times (roughly).  If it's rock hard and doesn't move, then the corresponding gas cell is cactus.  If she's been grovelling for that long it's likely at least the rear bump stops are toast.

The brakes may be seized, but they're easy to fix.  Bank on a full fluid change and new brake hoses.  A full coolant flush will be a must and the radiator may be stuffed.

Check for rust around the firewall and the sunroof frame (you'll have to open it first).  Also check for rust in the sills around the jack points, lower rear quarters and around the windscreens.  Check for cracks in steering box mounts, front crossmember and rear chassis above the axles.

Thanks oversize.

If it goes ahead, I'm planning on a pretty much every fluid change. Does the fluid in the suspension system ever need changing, or is it best left well alone if it is working?

The car seems to pump up to full height (I don't know if it will go to the 'high' setting or not) but as seen in the side-on pic, does settle to a lower position than I would have expected.

I don't know why it was parked up. To be honest, I forgot to ask! Dazzled by an (apparently) rust-free W116, I guess.

There are quite a few 116s of various types over here, and generally several 280SEs for sale at any one time. I like the M110 engine, but the M100... Well, y'know how it is. :)

If I do go for this, I ask one thing... Please be patient with me! I'll doubtless have many questions. ???

No air filter would be a worry, as it will cause accelerated engine wear.  The A/C may need regassing, but in NZ R12 may be far cheaper than Aus.

I spy a battery isolator switch in there...

Oh and the fuel will be completely off, plus there's usually sediment and rust in a 32+ YO steel tank.  Plus condensation and water.  I'd suggest removal of the tank for a thorough clean and reseal, plus a new fuel filter.  Don't run her for long on the old fuel, as you may cause more damage to the pump and fuel distributor.

Settling low could be a problem with the central cell not keeping residual pressure.  It's common for the links between the front and rear control valves to break and the suspension will fail to self-level or settle at a strange height.

BTW yes the SLS reservior should be removed and thoroughly cleaned.  After years of operation there can be a lot of gunk that settles in the bottom.  Make sure you clean it so it's spotless; even a tiny grain of sand can cause problems later.  Replace the filter and bottom hose while you're at it.

DO NOT DRIVE IT if the suspension is rock hard; you can cause all sorts of damage....

As you can see there's plenty to keep you occupied and you can spend plenty too if you can't do much yourself.  Some say poverty is owning a horse... but they don't know about the 6.9!!!  LOL!  At least it's not a 6.3, or Grosser!!  Or a RR!!

The reward is driving it!  A well sorted 6.9 is gold...   ;D 8) ;D

And could it be there's no cracks in the dash???

Can you tell I'm excited by this find??  LOL!   ;D

an import, would be really interesting to find out why stored for 15 years?
also the mileage could be dodgy. as its an import, likely UK and odometer may be in miles with a km face plate. but depending on the price might not matter.
i know its hard to refrain, but don't get excited into a high price if you're not happy because its a rare 6.9. as major tom said, it wil suck a lot of money out of you quickly.  the 5 spheres have a generic life of 5-6 years, so you can be sure you will need to replace all 5 at 300 dollars each (AU) and then labour alone. what is the VIN out of interest and what year was it? good luck and keep us posted
regards from the wild west

Looks like the real deal to me.  (A good value and a car worthy of consideration).

It almost looks to me like the front tire is a bit larger than the rear...  probably just a trick of the light/angle.  I've had personal experience with several long-storage MBs and I can tell you that for some reason they seem to "come back to life" if driven regularly for a while.

I think the plan of changing all the fluids is a good one, and if it runs - put an air filter on the car and drive it while you work the bugs out.

John - I like that approach! 8)

My wife has the ubiquitous 4x4 soft roader - a Mazda Tribute V6 (for those in the US, it's a Ford Escape) - but as we live in a very rural area I hope she can be forgiven; at least ours has lots of mud on it, unlike the Cayennes, X5s, Q7s etc that we see around town.

I'm looking at a Centenary edition MB 190E 2.0 for daily duties, and the 6.9 for driving as often as possible.

Quick question - where do I find the option codes on a W116 (6.9)?

Edit: I was getting confused with other makes of car where the manufacturer hasn't kindly stamped them into a plate! D'oh...  ::)

And where on the engine is the engine number?

Edit: The engine number is stamped into the ledge of block behind the cylinder head on the motor's left. OK... Is that readily seen while the engine is in the car? Probably not? (Although this pic is of a 6.3.)

(http://ww2.justanswer.com/uploads/eurotec/2011-09-12_200932_m100engine.jpg)

Ta.

You can see the engine number while the motor is in the car - you will need a torch though, and probably some spray-on carb-cleaner of the like to clean the area. 

Indeed, it is in that exact location (as on the 6.3).

Tim

Thanks guys. (http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y261/gjm123/smilies/thumbup.gif)

So, today I went to have a look at this 6.9.

First impression - it looks better in the metal than in pics. That said, the rear left side door shut (that's the passenger side for those of us in NZ, Oz, UK, etc) looks a different colour to the rest - it is a much more 'green' colour. I couldn't get a photo to show the difference.

The car was parked up about 17 years ago, when the (then) owner bought a Lexus. Maybe for fuel economy reasons?  :)

For a subsequent couple of years it was taken out very, very occasionally. Then the owner died and it was parked up, and has sat in dry storage almost ever since. There are a number of other very nice cars and motorcycles forming a part of the deceased estate in a pseudo-museum environment. The car is being sold on behalf of the estate and museum.

When it was to be moved, the suspension had (understandably) collapsed. Sufficient thought wasn't given to this as it was initially moved without pumping up the suspension first, and damaged the front wheel arches in the process. D'oh.  ::)

It was then taken to a bodyshop where the arches were repaired and primed, but not repainted. Allegedly this was due to uncertainties about the car's future, but I suspect someone finally saw sense and realised that matching 32 year old metallic paint wasn't going to be easy.


It's a similar story on both sides. And there have been a couple of knocks to the bumpers. For instance:


There is also a little rust showing through behind the lower arch of the drivers' side front wheel. Common problem, and in this case far from beyond saving. The paint has broken, but I was unable to deform the metalwork with my thumb.

There is no other rust, anywhere, that I could find. I had the spare wheel out (someone has been in the boot already - the panel covering the fuel tank had been fitted upside down) and the wheel well was perfect.

The PO fitted a stainless exhaust system. This was done about 20 years ago; the seller described the 'tinny' sound a new stainless system makes, and how over a couple of years this went away.

There are other issues. The footwells are wet, and in at least one case full of water (under the carpets and sound deadening material). This is not a normal case of blocked sunroof drains, either - there is no sunroof. The seller says it is due to the seals in the vents behind the rear door windows having perished - he pressure washed the car when it came out of storage and a lot of 'dead' rubber washed out from the vent area.

The tyres are original Michelin XWX. To be fair they don't look in bad condition, but after 15+ years surely they must be flat-spotted?

The seats are very springy, and the drivers seat shows wear to the outside:


But I'm picking holes.

The biggest issue (for me) was not being able to hear the engine run. There was no battery in the car.
The battery isolator was installed, as it is in all of the cars in the collection, so that the battery can be electrically separated from the car and maintained.
The car has recently been started twice - it was run once for a couple of minutes, and once for 10-15 minutes. On neither occasion was fuel put in the fuel tank; it was started using Avgas and petrol poured directly into the engine (which is why the airfilter was removed in earlier pics). On both occasions it would not tickover and ran at ~3500rpm, while belching clouds of black smoke. The engine did run smoothly (I'm told). I asked if a battery was available and was told that would be up to the buyer, but that if the engine was not as described, I could take the car back for a refund. The seller described a steel/aluminium interaction and subsequent seizure which prevents the 'plunger' (his word) part of the throttle from moving up and down. I'm not sure if he was referring to the WUR or something else.
This video on YouTube - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZzuEmr-a_A - shows and describes how it should be done, but I suspect this procedure may not have been followed this time.

There is oil on the under side of the engine, but while wet this appears to be older. The oil on the dipstick is very dark grey and quite thick.

So. The bodywork is good, much better than the majority of cars of this age. The chrome is all good. The interior is good and while it is currently damp - this wetness is recent; there is no odour of long-term damp.

The suspension appears to have held 'up' very well indeed. One of the accumulators has been replaced and when I saw the car today, I was assured it had stood for at least a couple of weeks, but it was no lower than shown in earlier pictures.

There are no 'fancy' options:


So, a Becker radio, automatic antenna, tinted and heat-insulating windows, and a reading light in the rear. And the colour is blue/grey metallic.

Two more pics: chassis number:


VIN plate:


Info re other documentation may be forthcoming early next week.

I suspect I will regret it if I don't make a real effort to buy this car. What, based on the limited info I have been able to glean, do people think this might be worth as-is?

awesome graham. their is always something about the thrill of the chase in finding a 6.9.  sad story. i bet the PO loved this car, very sad its sat wasting away.
as you said, without running the car its hard to say. i would have no doubt it was very well looked after. any man that runs XWXs loves his 6.9 and im sure that
mentality was used on all aspects of maintenance. however, 15 years is a really long time for a car to sit and their would likely be a lot of stuff to be done.
upload a few more overall pics, what were the km's again?
very cool
keep us all posted

According to the speedo, it's covered less than 135000 km.

Unfortunately I've uploaded all the pics I have. I'm not sure exactly how long the car has been outside, but it's less than 4 months in the last 15 years.

I would have changed the engine oil before starting it up, particularly after 17 years.

Not hearing the engine run is a good bargaining point though.

Lucky they did pour fuel down the AFM, but did they remove the fuel pump relay? I'd be asking those questions because the fuel in the tank would be disgusting.

The guy may be referring to the fuel distributor plunger... These are likely to seize if left for a long time, but the can be freed by removing the device and soaking etc.

No sunroof is most interesting for a 6.9.

It certainly still looks a good car if you can get it at a reasonable price... Is it registered?

Water on the floors could just be the screen seals, or firewall rust (proabably unlikely if it has been stored inside for all this time. The vents at the rear don't have any seals as such, it's just sheet metal. The stuff that fell out was just an open cell foam that it is there from the factory.

Tim

Quote from: TJ 450 on 18 August 2012, 08:05 AM
I would have changed the engine oil before starting it up, particularly after 17 years.

Me too!

QuoteNot hearing the engine run is a good bargaining point though.

It's an auction... But it is certainly something to bear in mind.

QuoteLucky they did pour fuel down the AFM, but did they remove the fuel pump relay? I'd be asking those questions because the fuel in the tank would be disgusting.

Not sure... But the seller was adamant that the fuel tank would have to come out and be cleaned. (Something I would do anyway.) Maybe something was done and this is why the in-boot cover over the fuel tank had been removed? The seller didn't know anything about that.

QuoteThe guy may be referring to the fuel distributor plunger... These are likely to seize if left for a long time, but the can be freed by removing the device and soaking etc.

No sunroof is most interesting for a 6.9.

It certainly still looks a good car if you can get it at a reasonable price... Is it registered?

Rego is on hold 'til next year. And price... That's a big question! What is it worth? At the moment, I don't know.

QuoteWater on the floors could just be the screen seals, or firewall rust (probably unlikely if it has been stored inside for all this time. The vents at the rear don't have any seals as such, it's just sheet metal. The stuff that fell out was just an open cell foam that it is there from the factory.

Tim

I wonder how so much water got into the car... The rear driver's side footwell could have had fish in it! The water was clean and while the carpets were wet, there was (as I said) no smell of damp, so it's fairly safe to assume the water is fairly fresh. Very odd.

Cool, it sounds like the seller would have taken some care then if he recommends removing the tank. :)

I'm not sure about the NZ market, but a car like that registered here is probably worth a few grand realistically. Seeing as it's an auction I'd just play it by ear and see if there's much interest.

What it really depends on is how badly someone wants it, and what they're prepared to pay.

Tim

Bidding is up to NZ$3.5k... I've seen much worse ones sell, in the UK, for the equivalent of at least twice that.

I'll give it some serious thought. There's plenty of time.

If you can get it for less than $5K NZ then you've done well.  If you consider the Aussie exchange rate, it's bugger all.  But budget on the fact you'll need to spend another $5K to get her on the road and be reliable.  And that's if you can do some of the work yourself....

Given the oil's 17YO you're probably wise not to start her at all!  Unlikely she'd run well anyway.  All you need to know is she's not seized.  Hopefully the odd coloured oil isn't indicating a blown headgasket?  She'll need a thorough flush of the old oil and a total going over of the whole fuel system.  Is the tank still in there?

I'd have another look at the car and check the firewall for rust.  Make sure all that water's drained out and all the carpets are removed to thoroughly dry.  On these cars even the sound deadening under the carpet will absorb water and take a long time to dry.  The car should be kept under cover with the windows open and a bar heater kept inside.  It doesn't take long for mould to grow and you'll never get rid of the smell.

I'd be quite happy to get the car home, strip the seats and carpets out and leave it to dry out for a week or two. That'd give me time to get the fluids changed, too.

The oil looks OK, but dirty - this is hardly a scientific or technical evaluation, though. There's no sign of emulsification inside the filler or on the dipstick, and no sign of oil in the water.

I'm trying not to put my rose-tinted specs on, but this does look a good project... If it can be had at the right price. 6.9s aren't common anywhere, but are particularly rare in NZ. And this one is a 'NZ new' - it was imported by a MB distributor/dealer and sold as a new car here.

Bodywork has minor problems to be sorted. Mechanics are complete and (currently) appear that they should work, although I would expect the brake calipers to have seized. The seals in the aircon have likely long-since dried out. (Is the aircon pump driven off it's own belt?)

Buying it and expecting to drive it would be silly. My guess is 4-8 weeks from purchase before it could be used.

hi Graham,
are you certain its NZ official delivery? just curious because Australian delivery cars all had sunrooves (i know it was a deletable option) and velour was not an option i understand.  i would have thought that Aus and NZ would get the same setup? interesting and good luck!
nathan

It is listed as being 'NZ new'... But that's not necessarily the same as actually being NZ new, of course.

I will certainly be checking this.

mmm... this sounds like mine and s class' kinda project  8)
My 450 SE was parked up for 8 yrs outside under a carport at 1800m altitude, untill 2yrs ago.
The fuel tank was rusted badly inside so I guess that's where you'll have to start, and work yr way through to the fuel distributor etc to ensure no rust/dirt is present.
Also, the calipers weres stuffed.
At 306 000kms the motor upon start-up was perfect. The gearbox needed topping up and required no further work other than servicing...
so the motor and gearbox ie seals seem to hold up well when laid up for long.

Quote from: graham on 18 August 2012, 09:15 PM
Buying it and expecting to drive it would be silly. My guess is 4-8 weeks from purchase before it could be used.

If you work full-time on it.   ;)

Quote from: graham on 14 August 2012, 09:03 PM
a very quick and frankly cursory once-over didn't show any rust. Even the chrome looks good.

There's a rust bubble forming under the paint to the left of the boot lid.  My ivory 300SD has one in the same place.  Shouldn't be a big deal but you'll want to address it.

Quote from: Casey on 19 August 2012, 01:23 AM

Quote from: graham on 14 August 2012, 09:03 PM
a very quick and frankly cursory once-over didn't show any rust. Even the chrome looks good.

There's a rust bubble forming under the paint to the left of the boot lid.  My ivory 300SD has one in the same place.  Shouldn't be a big deal but you'll want to address it.

Thanks Casey - I'd missed that. The tops of both front arches need attention following the manoeuvring incident, the the bottom of the driver's side front wing, between the arch and the door, has the usual problem.

Quote from: s class on 19 August 2012, 01:19 AM

Quote from: graham on 18 August 2012, 09:15 PM
Buying it and expecting to drive it would be silly. My guess is 4-8 weeks from purchase before it could be used.

If you work full-time on it.   ;)

I concur with that. Even a good one is quite an undertaking, but well worth the effort of course.

Tim

Assuming we go for it and the bidding doesn't get silly, I'll be sure not to tell Mrs M about the timeframe to get it on the road!  ;)

Quote from: nathan on 18 August 2012, 10:08 PM
hi Graham,
are you certain its NZ official delivery? just curious because Australian delivery cars all had sunrooves (i know it was a deletable option) and velour was not an option i understand.  i would have thought that Aus and NZ would get the same setup? interesting and good luck!
nathan

As an ex-kiwi fromthat era there are two comments I would make,

1. NZ delivered cars if delivered new would have had very individual specifications and would bear no resemblance to Oz models. They would have been based on UK spec with euro motors.
2. It still has it's original number plates and from memory JC series plates would have been current for that time (late 70's)
3. Velour upholstery was more expensive than leather and in almost all markets except Oz and USA it was the prefererred option
4.At that price go for it but expect some money to be spent to get it right.

Bill

A little more info is coming to light from sources other than the vendor.

I put the reg. into Carjam, and this suggests first NZ registration on 15th December 1993.

I also asked Ron B for his help and thoughts. The order number - 180 853 6126 80 - roughly translates that the car was sold new (or ordered) in Lebanon. He concurs that velour interior was an expensive option and recommend contacting Tom Hanson at the Classic center for a copy of the data card. That's something I'd do if I buy the car.

An NZ delivered car would have a New Zealand rego paper with it, but Ron doesn't remember anyone in New Zealand having a new 6.3 or 6.9. And the vendor doesn't seem to have an original rego paper either, although he does have up to date docs (rego is on hold, etc).

Of course, this car now being available in an auction, all this info is going to make no difference to the selling price or the seller. Or, ultimately, the buyer; a good 6.9 is a good 6.9 regardless of origin and I'm just trying to establish provenance before paying.

I would disagree that a JC plate is from 1992 unless the plate had been transferred from another car.

I owned two cars in that era a 1978 Daimler Sovereign Coupe - "HQ99" and a 1979 Datsun 280ZX - JF 4656.

I had a friend with a 1980 380SE - "KA 380"

Until the later 80's all number plates were made in a prison in NZ and were issued sequentially and remained with that car for life.

Apart from being sequential they were also issued in batches to various regions so you could usually know how old the car was and where it came from by looking at the number plate.

Bill

Quote from: WGB on 20 August 2012, 01:35 AM
I would disagree that a JC plate is from 1992 unless the plate had been transferred from another car.

I owned two cars in that era a 1978 Daimler Sovereign Coupe - "HQ99" and a 1979 Datsun 280ZX - JF 4656.

I had a friend with a 1980 380SE - "KA 380"

Until the later 80's all number plates were made in a prison in NZ and were issued sequentially and remained with that car for life.

Apart from being sequential they were also issued in batches to various regions so you could usually know how old the car was and where it came from by looking at the number plate.

Bill

I knew having an interst in cars would be useful - I'm learning some Kiwi history now! (Thanks Bill.  :) )

I've updated my post... I could swear that Carjam said 15/12/1992, but looking again (just now) it says 15/12/1993. However, it also says the car has been re-registered, and was "previously registered in New Zealand". It does go further to say that the plate type is 'Personalised', and the 'Was Registered Overseas?' section states 'No'.

More importantly, it also says "Registration Origin:   NZ New" 8)

Another possibility is that the car was delivered under the Overseas Expat Scheme.

If you lived overseas for 2 years and owned the car for 12 months you could bring the car back to NZ duty free.

Many people with overseas jobs would take delivery of a new car - not register it and park it in their garage - while they drove around in an old clunker or employment provided transport and then bring a "brand new"  12 month old car back to NZ.

This was sometimes used in conjuction with the "tourist delivery Scheme that M-B, Porsche and others offered.

Bill

Interesting... Thanks Bill.

The car is currently showing as having had two owners. I know ownership was transferred from Mr Previous Owner to his wife, but don't know if this constitutes the entire ownership history.

Bidding has topped NZ$5000 with 21 hours still to run.

At this rate, maybe I'll be better off looking for a 450... And to think I passed up a 380 for $1500!

Quote from: graham on 21 August 2012, 10:23 PM
Bidding has topped NZ$5000 with 21 hours still to run.

At this rate, maybe I'll be better off looking for a 450... And to think I passed up a 380 for $1500!

No, no.  You really need the 6.9.  $1500 380's are not at all hard to find.  450's are nice enough but eh.  This 6.9 seems like something you really need to end up with.  Sounds like it will be a good bargain in any case!

Quote from: Casey on 21 August 2012, 11:19 PM
No, no.  You really need the 6.9.  $1500 380's are not at all hard to find.  450's are nice enough but eh.  This 6.9 seems like something you really need to end up with.  Sounds like it will be a good bargain in any case!

Oh, I agree!

I'm struggling to convince Mrs M of this... I think she is sold on the 'buy it, garage it, immediately sort the wet/damp (it's a free fix) and do the rest as time and money allow' idea. Unfortunately I have a fixed budget for car expenditure, and it has got to include something reliable that I can use immediately. Two cars is OK, but one of them must be ready now.

Dunno about you, but a cheap 4-cylinder, 4-door Japanese small saloon really doesn't do anything for me. And that could be all I can afford if the price keeps going up!

I thought I had a solution earlier today - a NZ$1500 W124 300E saloon. All OK, until I found the headgasket had gone. :(

<sigh>

Well it depends entirely on your budget....  Given enough $, anything can be fixed quickly!  You'll get far more satisfaction from a 6.9 than a 300E.  And I think it's far better to invest in a 'classic' chrome bumper Benz than one that's made in the 90s and full of plastic.

And if you don't buy one you'll have to change your avatar!

Quote from: oversize on 22 August 2012, 12:13 AM
Well it depends entirely on your budget....  Given enough $, anything can be fixed quickly!  You'll get far more satisfaction from a 6.9 than a 300E.  And I think it's far better to invest in a 'classic' chrome bumper Benz than one that's made in the 90s and full of plastic.

And if you don't buy one you'll have to change your avatar!

The 300E would be a daily driver kinda thing... While the 6.9 is in the garage and being sorted. :) So it's not a 300E instead] of a 6.9. It's as well as.

I can have two cars - or possibly more ;-) - so long as I stay in budget.

You sound like I used to think. See my signature to see how well that worked out.

So my advice is, drive an old Toyota for a while if necessary, or even a moped, if it means you can swing the 6.9. :)

A p.o.s. may be the answer. But I detest driving anything less than interesting!

Good advice Casey!!!  Ahhhh I thought it was INSTEAD of!  So you want something cheap n reliable while you sort the 6.9.....  And interesting?  Try a early 90s Toyota Seca manual with the 1.6L 4AGE DOHC engine.  Lotsa fun and completely chuckable!   ;D

I'm chasing a couple of W124s at the moment: a 260E, lowered and running on 18s (even the seller says they rub  ::) ), and a 300E-24 with 2 owners from new.

Neither will cost more than NZ$2k.

By comparison, a 4AGE-equipped Toyota Corolla (same as an Oz Seca) with 200k++ on it looks like costing ~$3500.

Besides, the 300E-24 is (I think) the only W124 engine I've not driven. :) That's got to be as good a reason to go after it as any!

A 300 E 24 will be fast, and a treat to drive daily.

Quote from: pompy on 22 August 2012, 05:17 AM
A 300 E 24 will be fast, and a treat to drive daily.

That'll do very nicely.  :D

I was thinking hard for something other than a Corolla, but I came up with zip.  A 24V would be perfect!!!  Just don't blow the trans or the ECU!!!  $$$$$ nasty!  I was actually considering one before I was afflicted with W116 (6.9) addiction......

I'll drive it gently. Apparently the a/c isn't working... So long as the windows do work, I'm sure I'll manage.

Bidding for the 6.9 now at NZ$5100. 13 hours to go. C'mon guys - what's it worth?

The most I've paid was $5500AU which equates to $7095NZ.  And even the most expensive of mine needs lots of work before she'll hit the road....  $5100NZ = $3953AU so it's currently a bargain!

This one at least doesn't appear to need $000s worth of bodywork. There's obviously a lot that does need doing, but just owning the car would be a good start!

At the moment I get anxious just thinking about the amount of water sitting inside it... (http://l.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/42.gif) I just want to get it home, get the seats and carpets out, and let it dry!

My first looked like it'd been in a flood!!  Or driven into a river!!  LOL!   :o  Bloody sunroofs and windscreen seals (plus some firewall rust)!!

I know the feeling re; the water... I just had to mop some up off the floor in my 280S and I was cringing. It has now been dried out and is now under a waterproof but breathable car cover. The windscreen leaks due to rust (the only significant rust on the car, just fore of the a pillar trims on both sides).

Seeing as they're so rare in NZ, I wouldn't hesitate to spend more than 6k to get it, if it is worth that much to you... I always view it as once you've got it you can work on it to bring it up to standard at your leisure.

I spent about 10k on mine (including purchase price) to get it to the level it is now, but it was a neglected car and needed a trans rebuild, spheres, suspension work, not to mention a paint job.

I'd happily drive mine anywhere as long as it doesn't get rained on.

You're off to an excellent start with that car!

One thing to be aware of with the 6.9 is that you won't get your money back (at least in the foreseeable future), so it really is a just a love affair to own one.

Tim

P.S. Have you read the "Illustrated Buyer's Guide" by Frank Barrett? I read that about 50 or more times before I finally decided to get a 116, and I was just itching to get a 6,9!

Tim

That's what I said to Ryan the other day, because 6.9's are so rare in RSA - if I can just get my hands on even an average 6.9 which I can afford, the initial outlay isn't so much. I can then, as I have money to spend, at my own pace get it to standard.
So, if I were you, I'd just buy it. You wont regret it ;)

I'd say the value is a lot more than the current bids. 8)

Besides which, when will you get such an opportunity again? A lot sounds right about this car.  Life is short; enjoy it!

We may step out of value and worth, and into what I can (edit: immediately) afford... :(  Most of our money is still tied up in the UK.

To compound interest, the seller has just said that all the original service books are with it...

I can see this heading towards $10k by the end of the morning. It's already at $5500.

<sad posting>

I set myself a limit of NZ$6500. A figure dictated by how much money we could quickly get our hands on... This immigration lark throws up all sorts of unexpected problems!

It wasn't enough.

A little cajoling and Mrs M agreed to running to NZ$7000. This looked good, but... Well, someone else had more $ available to them than I currently do.

There were in fact several more bids after this, and the car eventually sold for NZ$7600. I have no doubt that it was worth this, but as is the nature of auctions, had I bid even NZ$8000, someone else could easily have bid NZ$8100.

I'm not bitter. Disappointed, yes. But in the process of looking at this car I have learnt a lot, one of the most exciting things being that this is not the only NZ new 6.9 - there is at least one other, a silver one, somewhere.

And the stage is set for a future purchase. :)

Many thanks to all here for their support and advice while I pursued this car... There will be others. In the meantime, hopefully my experience will be of use to other people.

</sad posting>

Ouch. $600 away. :(. Maybe you can get contact info of the buyer and arrange to buy it for more than he paid a few months out?

Well, now you can find a cheap W123 (or nasty nasty W124), and make sure it's in decent repair while saving up some more. 450's are really quite nice too. If they are as cheap there as they are here, you may even consider one as your "budget" ride. :)

It was NZ$1100 over my original budget, so I was really quite a way off. And the winner of the auction bid many times in the last hour of the auction, so I guess he (or she) is quite keen. I will try contacting them but don't hold out much hope for a future purchase from them. That said, I know there were several interested parties who already had at least one 6.9, so there may be some hope. How many 6.9s can one person need somewhere the size of New Zealand? :)

There are several 380s around and for sale, and more than a few 280s. I saw a good 280SE with 300,000+ kms under it's wheels recently sell for well over NZ$3000.

Anyway, time to get my breath back (so to speak), regroup, and hopefully be prepared for a purchase rather than have the opportunity more-or-less thrust upon me, as was the case this time around.

.

The dream is far from over!

I've been holding the import idea at arms length, if only because of the import and tax issues. Viewing, inspecting and evaluating could also be a problem, unless... :D

.

We've only just got here! I don't think Mrs & Miss M would be too happy if I were to suggest changing country - again - so soon... Besides, doesn't Oz have millions of poisonous critters that crawl or slither?

.

Something to think about in the long term is having one shipped over from the East Coast of Australia. It's a similar distance from Sydney - NZ as Sydney - Perth... Certainly worth considering. Just a thought. 8)

But yes, getting a more plentiful model in the interim also has its merits.

Tim

Quote from: graham on 23 August 2012, 04:25 AM
We've only just got here! I don't think Mrs & Miss M would be too happy if I were to suggest changing country - again - so soon... Besides, doesn't Oz have millions of poisonous critters that crawl or slither?

Common fear held by overseas visitors Graham, I suspect its part of a conspiratorial international joke on us as payback for the "Chuck a shrimp on the barbie" adverts..........

If you live up North or in arid regions then its a valid concern if you are prone to doing silly things as Major Tom said but if you live in cooler climes (Say Victoria) and in suburbia then you have nothing to fear.

One advantage of arriving in New Zealand from the UK is that the buying power of the Euro will set you up VERY nicely in NZ although you will also do nicely in Australia.

It is worth keeping in mind though for the future.

Re your Auction............

I am always sceptical at Auction results especially on sites such as Trademe and eBay as it isnt out of the relms of possability that someone was bidding to artificially drive the price up (Schill bidding) and that once stuck with the item due to over enthusiasm they disappear and the item is relisted or offered to the 2nd highest bidder at their top bid or by negotiation.

So sit on your cash for a day or so and see what eventuates as you may get a second chance.

Why would i mention this?

Because if I were genuinely bidding to win id just make my first and last bid moments before the end of the auction with a little room for more incase..........

And if I were feeling out the other bidders id chip away with small bids to reveal the highest bid of a competitor and then bid slightly higher hoping they would pip me at the post in the final seconds knowing I have a 2nd chance offer up my sleeve if they dont outbid me.

So Take heart in my hypothesis and hang on a day or so.

Tony

Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 23 August 2012, 04:08 AM
Graham, there are regularly 6.9's for sale in the eastern states of Australia, surely you could buy one here for a few grand and ship it over ?

The dream is not over, another one WILL come by  8)

Um I haven't seen a cheap one for sale for quite a while now.....  And in NZ they're definitely not thick on the ground.  Shipping a car could cost bucketloads.  I've heard $5K from the USA.  Probably a $2K to NZ.  Road freight is far cheaper at around $800 from WA to Vic, but not an option for an overseas buyer.

Sorry to hear you missed this one Graham, but I'm sure something else will come up.  Obviously this one wasn't meant to be for now.  I'd buy that 24V NOW!!!

BTW if you do contact the new owner of the 6.9, tell them about the ORG because I'm sure we'd all like to see its progress....

If I contact the buyer, find he's on here already and has been following my thread...  >:(

Whatever. I will try to get in touch with him or her. The comment re shill bidding is an interesting one - one of the multiple bidders (but not the winner) had very low rep (although it is 100%), was a lass (unusual but obviously far from impossible) and registered in Christchurch (so was unlikely to have seen the car before bidding). Over $7.5k is lot of money to commit to something you've not seen. Well, where I come from, it is. :) Still, innocent 'til proven guilty. (I'm far too nice!)

Going to give the 24V seller a call shortly.

Yerssss....

The alleged practice is not as uncommon as you'd think either.

In the past year i have bought maybe 15 cars on Auction sites and 10 of em were sight unseen and based on the pictures, prior knowledge of the type of vehicle and phone conversations with the owners.

I have bid on far more than that, maybe 35 or so and have received 12 2nd chance offers and I dont know how many "Your watched item has been relisted. Don't let it slip away this time." emails.

Then there are the "Relisted due to non paying buyer" sob stories sometimes with empathic and yet angry rants lol

I rarely take a 2nd chance offer BTW unless I can screw them down on price and hopefully they wont be naughty next time.

Re the 300E?

Im not a fan of the engine at the age these cars are today, check the coolant and make sure its Mercedes coolant or type approved or you may have issues with porosity and head gaskets.

Quote from: Tony66_au on 24 August 2012, 07:48 AM
Yerssss....

The alleged practice is not as uncommon as you'd think either.

Sadly true. I always watch eBay bidding history carefully. Unfortunately this is harder these days; you used to be able to see what all the bidders other activity was so you could pretty easily spot a scam, but they hid the real usernames in the name of "privacy", which I think is rubbish. Some things, like bidding activity on a public website cluttered with scammers, should be open to the public.

Quote from: Casey on 24 August 2012, 08:11 AM

Quote from: Tony66_au on 24 August 2012, 07:48 AM
Yerssss....

The alleged practice is not as uncommon as you'd think either.

Sadly true. I always watch eBay bidding history carefully. Unfortunately this is harder these days; you used to be able to see what all the bidders other activity was so you could pretty easily spot a scam, but they hid the real usernames in the name of "privacy", which I think is rubbish. Some things, like bidding activity on a public website cluttered with scammers, should be open to the public.

It is more difficult but the intent is fairly plainly demonstrated on the hidden bids especially when low rep users tickle bid to show others highest bids and then sit without adding a high bid themselves.

Then again it could just be a real bidder looking to make others think the seller is tickling via proxy and walk away leaving the tickler to snap up a bargain............

I have to say that I have seen some ingenious plays over time and every time the sites think they have it beat someone comes up with something new to annoy and spoil.

.

.

I start all auctions at a penny with no reserve. No tricks. Real competition inevitably ensues, and I generally always fetch a good price this way. Also type out long honest descriptions and many good pictures. I post every question and answer publicly. Also use 7- or 10-day auctions. Buy it now is okay.

Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 24 August 2012, 05:52 PM
I never bother with auctions anymore and haven't done for years, I always go for buy it now.

the most annoying part of auctions is snipers, at the last 3 seconds you will loose the bid and have no time to respond - infuriating.

TradeMe is better than most in this respect. When listing, a seller can choose to include 'auto-extend' (or something similar): any bids placed in the last two minutes sees the auction extend by another two minutes.

This happened several times with the 6.9.

.

Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 25 August 2012, 08:26 PM
What a bloody good idea!

Ebay needs this now.

I think QXL had a similar thing.

I agree - this is appropriate, and better reflects a true auction scenario.

I just put my top dollar in 5 mins before the end and let it ride, if I lose the item I lose the item...........

Especially with project items I have bought the thing I wanted 6 or more months later because the original buyers wallet outstripped their ability, and often for what I was happy to pay or less the first time around.