Splitting up Mechanicals section ?

[oscar]

It was mentioned in another thread and it's something I've thought about before and think it's a great idea.  For starters splitting mechanicals into the base engine types, M110, OM617, M100 etc. 

I think categorising Mechanicals further will greatly assist cataloguing DIY tutes and searching for answers relevant to the thing we (me) tend to spend the most time on fixing, the engines.

M110 including carburettor, d-jet and k-jet
M116 inc d-jet and k-jet
M117 inc d-jet and k-jet
etc

You could merge M116 and M117 since they're so alike.  Would the relevant drivelines be included with their respective powerplants or would you have drivelines under a separate title?  Suspension another board?  Would you have to split up SLS, Hydro and conventional?  Probably not.

I'd hate to see the forum become too complicated with a myriad of buried boards but in the past I think the org started with just 4 and now there's 7 and 1 daughter board.  They've all arisen to help categorise the nature of various threads as the forum has grown.  Similarly, with increasing popularity of the org and my infrequent visits to what I used to do, I kind of get lost in the myriad of new threads these days and don't seem to have the time to visit the Community boards.  Most times I don't make it through Mechanicals.   It's inevitable it'll continue to grow and the Org has to adapt.  So is it time for such a change?  You know I hate change but this one would benefit everyone I believe.  What kind of Mechanicals boards would be best? 

[Mforcer]

When it comes to engines, transmissions etc, I am not knowledgeable (yet) but do generally enjoy reading most topics including those about carburettors and diesels which have no relevance to my car.

The first problem with splitting the Mechanicals section is that we assume everyone knows what type of engine they have and then what is specific to that engine and not a common part. As such, it may limit the discussion of shared components. We are still a relatively small group dedicated to an under-appreciated model that we should all be working together rather than trying to divide ourselves.

Forums that split discussions between models (W116 vs W123 vs W126 vs W107 etc) limit participation from someone that may be an expert of a W107 which shares the M116 and M117 engines but never participate in a W116 discussion as they have no interest in that model.

Perhaps we can encourage the use of more descriptive topic subjects. If you know what engine is being discussed why not include that in the subject such as "[M110] Adjusting mixture" instead of just "Adjusting mixture". On the other hand "1980 300SD Sunroof stuck" is a silly subject as the "300SD" is not relevant to the sunroof issue (I assume) and it is too easy for someone to overlook that topic if they only skim read the "300SD" part of the subject.

Not in the Mechanicals section but as an example, mega-long discussions like "Raptelan's 1980 300SD" help no one to contribute or find useful resources except for Raptelan to keep a public journal and for those that can keep up with the endless discussion. I personally would much prefer to see numerous individual discussions which are relevant to each specific subject.
[I am not trying to pick on Raptelan but that is just a current active discussion that has grown and become very prominent while the topic has morphed considerably from the original post - I gave up reading when I lost what the discussion was about.)

[oscar]

A lot of work to go through and decide what would go where and of course, the resto threads with a range of topics included besides engine and driveline wouldn't be able to be split up. (thinks of my main povo thread).

I agree that some wouldn't know what engine they have when first googling about their car but I suppose I'd envisage that an M110 daughter board for example would contain a longish broad title like "280 engines - M110 carburettor, d-jetronic and k-jetronic" to give enough clues to where to post or search.

It reminds me of when I first got the 350.  I had no idea it was a W116 let alone what engine it had besides a 3.5L.  Never knew Mercedes had "W" classifications for each style of chassis. Then I found this place   My dad had the car for 13 years prior and never knew it was a W116. 

Anyways, thanks for the input.

[Big_Richard]

most general car owners wouldnt know the chassis designation of their cars or what one even was Its only us true nut's that get that deep.

[koan]

Don't think creating sub-forums on engine types is a good idea, the place will end up too broken up. A lot of problems like rattles and noises, smoke and starting issues are common to all engines. Even major items like K and D-jet are shared. Only when you get down to specifics like bolt torques and chain tensioners are there differences which don't amount to much really.

I suggested (in good faith) splitting engine mechanicals into petrol and diesel sections and still think there's some logic in that because there are major differences between the two. Logical as it maybe I don't think its a good idea anymore just because of the tensions it causes.

What I do think would be a good idea would be to make better use of the Wiki. We could have D-Jet, K-Jet and diesel topics that contain theory of operation, fault finding, common problems and finally differences across engines. Along with that, topics dedicated to specific engines and their unique features.

Got to get the Wiki going, to begin with maybe someone (admin?) could seed it with an FAQ with questions needing answers, the common things like hard K-Jet cold starts, hunting D-jet, stuck heater flaps and we could fill them in.

Any thoughts?

koan

[oscar]

most general car owners wouldnt know the chassis designation of their cars or what one even was Its only us true nut's that get that deep.

So true, now you mention it.  Most wouldn't give a hoot, jsut drive till they trade em in.

koan, I must admit I don't know much about wikis apart from their appearance in star wars, but I have read the comments in the threads where it's been mentioned and think it's a great idea.  Over the years, the forum's kind of creating a definitive online workshop manual of sorts but it can be difficult sometimes to find relevant info and we rely on remembering something we've read in the past to help with the search to do a particular job.  Or rely on others to point us to the relevant thread.  The wiki sounds like  a great resource to streamline the search process and make instructionals and tutes more succinct.  So I'm all for it but not sure how to help.

[TJ 450]

Yeah,

I tend to concur here... Splitting it up may not be a good idea.

I'm happy with the descriptive title idea, but I'm pretty sure I've already been doing that where I'm not posting about a general W116 mechanical topic etc. I always thought about how it would appear when searching archives.

I think I read practically every topic when I first joined the forum.

Tim

[Gerard]

I'm also not in favour of splitting it up as i like to read about the 280, 350 and 450, and yes I enjoy reading about the 6.9 donkeys too!!  I want to learn about all the W116 models as I don't know which model I will be getting next...heh heh!

I'm a member of the Mercedes Club UK (Ireland branch) and they have a large forum and its split up by chassis type, I have to read through 5 or 6 separate sections as I'm interested in the W116 and W124 and R129.  So I feel I have to visit the 124, 201, 107, 116, 123, and 129 boards due to the commonalities.  On top of that, they have several "general sections" which most things get posted into, making the dedicated model threads largely redundant.
One guy recently posted a lovely W124 A-pillar repair in the "non MB related vent and chatter section ".

I contrast this with "www.peachparts.com" or "shopforum" as it used to be known in the States, which was (prob still is) a great forum.   It had few sections, Tech help, diesel discussion, and a few others so it was easy to navigate and informative.

I'm not in favour of a model/engine type segregation.  I enjoy reading about all W116 problems, and solutions offered here.  But, if there is sufficient demand, then a separate Diesel section could be set up and petrol-heads could visit that when they felt like it.

However, two things I have noticed since I joined the board,
1      the technical content of posts seems to have dropped a bit, and
2      topic discipline has lowered, with many threads wandering way off topic.

I think if they were addressed/encouraged, things might get a bit easier.

Heres hoping this remains a great corner of the internet for a long time yet!
Gerard

[Casey]

Not in the Mechanicals section but as an example, mega-long discussions like "Raptelan's 1980 300SD" help no one to contribute or find useful resources except for Raptelan to keep a public journal and for those that can keep up with the endless discussion. I personally would much prefer to see numerous individual discussions which are relevant to each specific subject.
[I am not trying to pick on Raptelan but that is just a current active discussion that has grown and become very prominent while the topic has morphed considerably from the original post - I gave up reading when I lost what the discussion was about.)

*nods* I agree here - it's gone off on various tangents especially since the 300SD got wrecked.  I do post updates on the 300SD but also a bunch of other junk.  On the other hand I think that's better than posting a bunch of other topics around...maybe I should have put a bunch of it in a single thread in Auto Torque instead.  It's not the only thread like that, but it's stayed pretty active.  I've long thought there needs to be some sort of combination between blogging/journalling and forum software, that allows members to each run their own blog and follow others they're interested in while also having shared discussion groups forum-style.  Maybe I'll write such a thing.

I personally don't care how it's organized - I read pretty much everything that's posted, unless it's to a thread that I've already looked at and decided I have no interest in following.

[koan]

I must admit I don't know much about wikis apart from their appearance in star wars,

I think you mean Wookies see Wookieepedia.

Over the years, the forum's kind of creating a definitive online workshop manual of sorts but it can be difficult sometimes to find relevant info and we rely on remembering something we've read in the past to help with the search to do a particular job.

We have some fantastic threads covering different jobs people have done over the years with lots of helpful pictures, they form a very practical online help manual.

An good example of a car Wiki is Holdenpaedia on the local GM product, not saying it's the best out there but I use it whenever i want to find something Holden related.

I have problems searching, often can't find things, its frustrating when you know something is mentioned on the forum somewhere but it just can't be found. A Wiki with named topics on specific jobs might make the knowledge more accessible.

Main reason I haven't jumped into the Wiki is the need to learn a new "language", I can cope with embedding URLs and pictures in posts but Wiki is a bit more complicated but once I bite the bullet and make a start I'll work it out.

koan

[koan]

I've long thought there needs to be some sort of combination between blogging/journalling and forum software, that allows members to each run their own blog and follow others they're interested in while also having shared discussion groups forum-style.  Maybe I'll write such a thing.

Not sure about that, initially it sounds like a good idea, a blog collection off to the side. "Fred's 280 SE blog", pictures of his car, what he's done, what he's doing next, his wheels, pictures of his engine but pretty sure it would stray off into fixing rust in a door or a brake overhaul and that sort of thing should be in the forum, not spread out in more places.

Maybe not a good idea after all.

koan

[calvin streeting]

what could work is if we could find a tool to convert posts into wiki pages. so users could discuss and blog on the forum (i to like the blog idea). but then when a good tech post is made it could be converted (not re done) into the wiki.. maybe even link back to the forum where it can be commented on.. just an idea.

with regards to spliting the mech forum, i agree no real idea of how, maybe same categories as the service manual...

calvin..

interesting topic this one.. as my job is a systems developer...

[adamb]

Calvin,

I like the idea of letting people rant but then being to turn one good post in the rant of many posts into a wiki for posterity. Or something similar. But somebody needs to be moderator and that's a tough one.

Otherwise, the current breakdown works for me almost. I'd split mechanicals into Mechanicals Engine and Mechanicals Non-Engine.

Cheers,
Adam

[Mforcer]

Adding content to the wiki is not too challenging, no more challenging than posting to a forum. Just give it a start with plain text and add formatting as you learn. Copying content to the wiki from the forum wouldn't be too difficult. The most difficult part of any forum post or wiki page is knowing what to write (and what to leave out).

[Casey]

Otherwise, the current breakdown works for me almost. I'd split mechanicals into Mechanicals Engine and Mechanicals Non-Engine.

This actually sounds ideal to me - Mechanicals and Engine.  Engine being any and all.