Went out yesterday afternoon drove a few hundred meters and flicked the left turn signal on and no flashing or dash indicator, something to fix when I get home I thought. Tried the right indicator, no flashing either.
Started to think about the possibilities as I quickly tuned into the traffic to avoid getting stuck behind a tram, maybe it's the flasher relay, tried the hazard flasher and that worked, not the relay then. Covered about two hundred meters thinking what else could it be, maybe just the fuse, but ... then the engine stopped. Tried to start it, cranked OK but no fire.
Three o'clock in the afternoon, tons of traffic, all the mums picking up the kids and a tram behind me dinging his bell. I got out and indicated I (We) weren't going anywhere, the trammy continued to ding his bell hoping it's magic powers would rectify the situation.
A man and a woman helped push the car round the corner into the next side street. Pondered for a while what would stop the indicators and then a short time later stop the engine. The usual crank in "R" revealed the fuel pump not running. A look at the fuse card showed fuse 4 for the indicators but nothing for the fuel pump. After some inspection of fuses in the fading light and getting nowhere I decided to walk home and grab a meter and have a look at the wiring diagram.
When I got back to the car a bit of probing with the meter showed fuse 4 had blown, replaced that, the indicators now worked but still no fuel pump. I could hear the fuel pump relay switching when I pushed on the k-jet air flow flap, next thing in the circuit to the fuel pump is the immobiliser relay. After some probing around there with the meter I couldn't find any Volts anywhere on the relay or the alarm wiring. Back to the fuse box and found fuse 1 blown, replaced that and the engine started.
I suspect I may have blown fuse 1 at some stage in probing because the central locking was working, then it wasn't, not sure.
Don't know what happened, unlikely two fuses burn out at the same time, nor can I work out why the engine ran for 30 secs after the first sign of trouble.
Question without notice - do you know how the fuses in box are numbered?
I didn't, I do now!
koan
Ahh! fun and games of owing a classic, at least we can fix them ourselves.
try doing that with a current model car.
Cheers
Quote from: robertd on 28 June 2011, 12:24 AM
Ahh! fun and games of owing a classic, at least we can fix them ourselves.
try doing that with a current model car.
Just a bit embarrassing, you just know everybody is thinking, "Poor guy can't afford a new car and he thinks an old Mercedes has class, tut tut" (class and me don't normally appear in the same sentence). If they only knew the costs!
Anyhow I've found why fuse 1 went Those two wires with the spade terminals on the ends, the ones that go to the secret alarm disable switch, they have hung there for about five years, since when I took out the heater duct, well when one gets grounded it blows the fuse. It happened again today while I was checking the wiring.
koan
Hi Koan
It's always a little disappointing getting stranded, even more so in peak hour traffic with the tram up your rear! You will recall last time I brought Mrs White home she threatened to do a similar thing on the M4 elevated section. Luckily, I do not have the alarm/immobiliser option fitted. (Our high petrol price is my immobiliser, ha,ha.)
I am really interested in your fuel pump diagnostic test. When you put the car in reverse and try to start it, how do you know if the fuel pump is working or not? Does it make some sort of noise from the right rear? And how long would you crank the engine when doing this test?
Great that you got her going again. I do know from the card insert in the fusebox, that number 4 also supplies the fuel supply shut off valve, but that is suffixed by a 'C' meaning on carby engines only (280S). I assume you've got a V8 in which case it is strange that the number four fuse stopped the engine.
Thanks
Gavin
I am assuming you have seen this picture on the 'org' before:
Fusebox insert
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/30427-1/Fusebox+insert.jpg)
Quote from: gavin116 on 28 June 2011, 01:17 AM
I am really interested in your fuel pump diagnostic test. When you put the car in reverse and try to start it, how do you know if the fuel pump is working or not? Does it make some sort of noise from the right rear? And how long would you crank the engine when doing this test?
Yes, you should hear the pump running and possibly the cold start valve squirting if it's cold enough, not sure about that though. Duration as long as it takes to hear the pump. Same technique can be used to pressurerise the fuel system for a quicker start if the car has been standing for a while.
This only works with k-jet 116s, later 123 k-jets have a clever relay to build up pressure prior to starting and to detect a stalled engine and shut off the pump.
I've got the card in my fuse box. Don't know if the cards are model specific.
my question is effectively which is fuse 4?
4th along the top row?
No.
koan
Hi Koan,
No, I make fuse four to be second row i.e. closest to the radiator, and second along from the driver's side (fender) in a RHD car. That's the one I used when doing the tach. If you have a very close look at the black plastic there was some lettering within the plastic itself.
Thanks about the fuel pump info. I have a K-jet too.
Perhaps Joe can confirm the above.
Regards
Gavin
Yep, found this picture of Mrs White's innards, and it confirms my fuse position:
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/30053-2/Upgraded+fuses.jpg)
Quote from: gavin116 on 28 June 2011, 08:13 AM
No, I make fuse four to be second row i.e. closest to the radiator, and second along from the driver's side (fender) in a RHD car.
That's right, odd numbered fuses are in the top row closest to windscreen, even numbered in the bottom row, increasing numbers left to right in the "looking at it direction", not the Mercedes-Benz "driving direction". Had me fooled, my unassisted aging eyes in the dying afternoon sun couldn't make out the numbers so I assumed fuse 4 was 4th in top row, WRONG!
koan.
Quote from: koan on 28 June 2011, 01:04 AM
Just a bit embarrassing, you just know everybody is thinking, "Poor guy can't afford a new car and he thinks an old Mercedes has class, tut tut"
koan
Well, in the states you get a pass for driving a "musclecar". "They" probably have no idea that you're driving a musclecar ;D
When I broke down in the 6.9 (loose battery terminal), people were yelling "get a Holden" haha. It is quite embarrassing though.
I don't like the sound of breaking down in the path of a tram in peak hour. That would be a moment of panic.
Tim
I have boken down many times (in various cars), even had a stearing column catch fire on a busy roundabout in rush hour... I never under stand why people think beeping there horn and shooting you helps. I never curse, or laugh, I either pull over and help or carry on and ("touch wood" proper dash :) ) hope it dosenot happen to me..
calvin
Quote from: TJ 450 on 28 June 2011, 12:19 PM
When I broke down in the 6.9 (loose battery terminal), people were yelling "get a Holden" haha. It is quite embarrassing though.
Thats when i shout out GAGF!
Also, when younger and saw a holden on tow or broken down, I'd shout out "take it to the rubbish tip"
It goes both ways anyway, and those p.o.s. vehicles are more often on the side of the road than anything else anyway so i've no idea what theyre gloating about.
yes its embarrassing but i'd not be caught in anything else, much like im sure we all feel.... the tram up the trunk does take a special "throw arms in air and smile" moment. similar thing happened to me pre my new radiator core/coil heatup issues. peak oclock - bottom of downtown Auckland , iddling . perplunk. no start. = didnt make many friends that day lol and only way in any direction was uphill! you had to laugh. for ten minutes there was no other option! lol
occasionally my coil still plays up and i have to wiggle the coil wire that goes to the ICU or the disty (cant recall now) - does anyone have a foto of what that connection is supposed to look like - i am not sure why mine is/seems loose in the coil top....
Quote from: jjb-w116-hu on 28 June 2011, 07:38 PM
occasionally my coil still plays up and i have to wiggle the coil wire that goes to the ICU or the disty (cant recall now) - does anyone have a foto of what that connection is supposed to look like - i am not sure why mine is/seems loose in the coil top....
If your talking about the green coaxial cable, they are available new. I replaced mine but cant remember whats involved at the distributor end. Clearly it wasnt that difficult or i would of remembered it 8)
Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 29 June 2011, 01:11 AM
If your talking about the green coaxial cable, they are available new. I replaced mine but cant remember whats involved at the distributor end.
Couple of screws hold the connector to the distributor, remove them and it should just pullout.
Expensive green wire if I recall.
koan
I think when i purchased it, it was $35, immediately after the price went to $80, no idea how much now.
The green coax has a fitting on the distributor end that makes electrical contact with the pickup inside. its the best part of $100 now.
Gee Koan! that's the worst feeling braking down in peak hour :(
I once broke down on Queensbridge on Friday peak hour years ago in a old Mazda rx7 :-[ i just wanted to push the car into the Yarra river and walk home rather than cop the abuse of the passers by ;D
Quote from: foss on 29 June 2011, 08:42 AM
I once broke down on Queensbridge on Friday peak hour years ago in a old Mazda rx7
When I was 18 my car died turning right out of Lonsdale St into King St right in the middle of the intersection at a 5PM. I was lot more embarrassed back then than I was the other day.
Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 29 June 2011, 03:55 AM
I think when i purchased it, it was $35, immediately after the price went to $80, no idea how much now.
Think I paid over $200 for mine and it was a while ago. Bought it because the insulation on mine was cracked at the distributor end, thought it would break, still going.
Edit: That doesn't seem right, maybe I'm thinking of the alternator diode assembly which I have as a spare, all my car troubles have been electrical, 95% alternator. Even the above incident was electrical, ignition.
koan
my 6.9 does not go into the cbd/peak traffic time unless its after hours with the sunroof open and a (usually) significant other in the passenger seat to look at the sky & lit up buildings. Its a pleasure craft and has never really been an essential form of transport for me as Ive always had a daily driver.
Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 29 June 2011, 06:17 PM
my 6.9 does not go into the cbd/peak traffic time unless its after hours with the sunroof open and a (usually) significant other in the passenger seat to look at the sky & lit up buildings. Its a pleasure craft and has never really been an essential form of transport for me as Ive always had a daily driver.
I understand your way of thinking and I used to be the same but over the last few years I've driven the 6.9 more and more just because I like driving it. I might be the odd one out here but I can't see the point of striving for perfection in a car and not driving it or being afraid to drive it in case it gets rained on, in fact it's the only car I feel safe with in the wet.
koan
Thats always a bummer breaking down, esp in rush hour. I had a close call not long ago when the car was together, the AAV caused a stall at a red light at the end of an exit ramp with several cars behind me.
I was honestly looking forward to removing D-jet, but its all in the air at this point.
Hope it is/gets sorted well Koan
Cheers
Quote from: koan on 30 June 2011, 01:15 AM
Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 29 June 2011, 06:17 PM
my 6.9 does not go into the cbd/peak traffic time unless its after hours with the sunroof open and a (usually) significant other in the passenger seat to look at the sky & lit up buildings. Its a pleasure craft and has never really been an essential form of transport for me as Ive always had a daily driver.
I understand your way of thinking and I used to be the same but over the last few years I've driven the 6.9 more and more just because I like driving it. I might be the odd one out here but I can't see the point of striving for perfection in a car and not driving it or being afraid to drive it in case it gets rained on, in fact it's the only car I feel safe with in the wet.
koan
my 6.9 like many other w116's leaks water in the rain. not from the firewall or windscreen, but under the passenger side door and also into the boot via the dodgy aftermarket seal. One of these days i will rectify these issues but id just rather not drive it in the rain anyway considering how much rust i had to have cut out of it when i first got it. My daily drivers for the past 5+ years have been company cars and its all too easy to continue driving for free on the weekends rather than pull my 6.9 out of the garage. Its more laziness than anything else.
One thing to check if it is leaking into the boot is the badges (if you have them). I spent ages looking for a leak and finally discovered it was coming in through the badges. I have yet to pull them off to see if the original plastic plugs are still there.
I almost got stranded today in the 190E... one of the alternator brushes reached the end of its life. Luckily, the battery gave up just as I pulled into the driveway. I've driven 3,000km now, and I'm using it for work, so I'm fortunate it didn't happen at a more critical time. I fitted a spare with good brushes, which took about 15 minutes and all is good.
But yes, my philosophy has always been "drive it everywhere", but I don't like driving the 6.9 in the rain.
Tim
My first car was an Austin A40 or something, had been having troubles with the start motor, amongst other things, for a while.
Not being mechanically minded at the time or having any tools, I had remedied the situation by parking on a hill at home and on a hill at work.
Rush hour traffic, friday afternoon after a hard week of carrying around bricks on a building site and I stall it on a two lane by two lane intersection in Mt Eden Auckland, within walking distance of home.
Had had enough, slam the door, walk away intending to abandon the thing and enjoy my weekend. Look back and there's a jeep with bull-bars behind it at the intersection. Few quick hand signals and he gives me a push start and away I went.
Can't believe I had the audacity to sell the thing to an acquaintance of mine, still feel guilty about that.