Author Topic: Option list W116 - The full Monty!  (Read 25137 times)

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #45 on: 19 November 2015, 07:35 AM »
I just bumped into this thing. A factory-produced console box for the W116
Strangely enough there are no markers that explain it's origins. Word is that it is an Italian aftermarket product, but no reason to believe this data is even remotely true.
Does anyone know anything?
The owner has agreed to hold it for me till tomorrow evening, at which point I will need to decide whether this is for me or not.

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #46 on: 19 November 2015, 07:11 PM »
Nobody? :-\

s class

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #47 on: 20 November 2015, 04:55 AM »
Well, what makes you think it is factory?  If it were, there would be a part number. 

'76 6.9 Euro, '78 6.9 AMG, '80 280SE, '74 350SE, '82 500SEL euro full hydro, '83 500SEL euro full hydro , '81 500SL

ptashek

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #48 on: 20 November 2015, 05:54 AM »
I think what Stan meant by "factory made" was that it may have been "mass produced".
I've personally never seen anything like it in a W116.

If there's no part number, it surely never came from MB. I'd make a pass.
It's smells as much of a money racket as slapping a 6.9 badge on a standard 450SEL.
1993 "Pearl Blue" W124 280TE
1979 "Icon Gold" W116 450SE (history, resto)

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #49 on: 20 November 2015, 06:53 AM »
Gentlemen, as always.. ;D

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #50 on: 21 November 2015, 05:06 PM »
With thanks to Ptashek:

http://oudemercedesbrochures.nl/Accessoires_USAca1978.html

Sheep-skin covers, fog lamp guards and wind deflector offered as original MB extras in 1978.
Even a breakerless ignition conversion kit for older models.

Is anyone able to get me part numbers for the original...?
Car Care Kit
Exterior car kit
Ignition Kit
Sheepskins
Extra floormats front?
And maybe an obvious question.. Were the fog lamps only for USA bumpers?

UTn_boy

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #51 on: 22 November 2015, 12:01 AM »
Here is what I have a list of:

Windscreen cleaner: 001-986-80-71-17
 
Car shampoo: 000-986-15-71

Insect remover: 000-986-76-71

Window cleaner: 000-986-40-71

Leather cleaner: 000-986-05-71

Tar remover: 000-986-02-71

Stain remover for textiles: 000-986-08-71

Chrome cleaner: 000-986-24-74

MB Polishing wool: 000-986-03-62

MB paint polish (nano polish): 000-986-05-61

MB paint protector and sealer: 000-986-06-74

MB polish (for removal of heavy contamination/oxidation on paint): 000-986-03-74

Chrome protectant: 000-986-28-74

Spray Chrome Protector: 000-986-97-36

MB De-icer: 000-986-77-71

Chrome protector (non-aerosol)  000-986-06-60

The upgrade for the points ignition system did have a part number, but I can't seem to find it at the moment.  I'll save you the trouble, though.  It hasn't been available in nearly 20 years.  What I do know is that it was made by a company called TRW for Mercedes Benz. 

Regarding footmat sets, Paragon and spare parts classics still show stock on certain colors.  Black, blue, bamboo, and maybe brazil.  all of the part numbers for the footmat sets start out the same....116-680-xx-xx-xxxx.  The ones that still come up as available are -32-99-9000, 32-99-5001, 03-99-8003, 02-99-9000, 02-99-6000, and 33-99-8004.  The last four digits of the part numbers will be your color code.  9000 is black, 5001 is blue, 8003 and 8004  are bamboo and/or date, and I think 6000 is green, but not certain.  However, these may not be available at all.  If you want to try to order any of them to see, deal with MB Classic directly from Fellbach, Germany.  I've recently discovered that dealerships here in the states, as well as the Classic center here in the states, don't show the same inventory that Fellbach does.  A most recent example involves a customer of mine.  He wanted a new wood panel that goes around the ACC buttons.  He asked if I had a used one, and I did, but I asked him why he didn't just order a new one.  He said that both his local dealership and the classic center here in the states said it was no longer available.  I halfway didn't believe that, so I had the dealer ship that I deal with contact Fellbach, and sure enough, it was readily available, and is currently on it's way.  So bear that in mind anytime you are told something isn't available an more.  You might be surprised! 

The bumper mounted fog lamps were pretty much a U.S. thing.  Why?  Well, we didn't have the European headlight units.....which have fog lamps integrated into them already. If you see a W116 with Euro headlamps AND fog lamps mounted underneath the bumper, then you have to wonder why anyone would need two sets of fog lamps.  It's rather redundant.   So in order to have fog lamps on a W116 with U.S. sealed beam headlights, they mounted them below the front bumper.  The early W116 U.S. cars that had the European bumpers had the fog lights mounted near the corners of the bumpers where they start to wrap around the fenders.  The later U.S. cars that had the 5 MPH crash bumpers had the fog lights mounted further inward towards the center of the bumper.  I believe they were both the same lighting unit, but only they were mounted in different locations according to whether or not it had Euro bumpers or the later ones. 

I currently am not armed with the answers for the fog lamp guards or the sheep skin mats.  I can say that even if we had the part numbers that they would only be of use for reference only.  However, I do have a few sets of fog lamp guards.  I never thought I'd use them, but they've grown on me.  :)
1966 250se coupe`, black/dark green leather
1970 600 midnight blue/parchment leather
1971 300sel 6.3, papyrus white/dark red leather
1973 300sel 4.5, silver blue metallic/blue leather
1976 280s astral silver/blue MB Tex
1978 450sel 6.9 Euro, Anthr/velour

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #52 on: 22 November 2015, 12:25 PM »
 :o

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #53 on: 23 November 2015, 06:51 PM »
Again, thanks to Ptashek

This one is interior focused, has some nice shots of the optional phone system.
http://oudemercedesbrochures.nl/SpecialeUitrustingen_0578.html

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #54 on: 23 November 2015, 06:55 PM »
Hirschmann data from a French fanatic;


Bien entendu, je n'évoque ici que les antennes électriques montées en usine sur les W116, donc ceci élimine les antennes manuelles, les antennes électriques d'époque installées chez les accessoiristes (souvent des antennes japonaises) et les antennes montées ultérieurement.

Les antennes électriques montées en usine sur les W116 sont donc exclusivement des Hirschmann 6.000 avec boîtier entièrement métallique.

Du début de la production (1972), jusqu'en juillet 1974, ce sont des Hirschmann 6.000 H montées dans l'aile avant-droite, le boîtier est métallique et sans finition particulière.

A partir du mois d'août 1974 et jusqu'en septembre 1976, les antennes sont toujours des 6.000 H mais elles sont désormais montées dans l'aile arrière-gauche (dans le coffre). Les boîtiers de ces antennes sont toujours métalliques mais ils sont peints en noir. Le tube fixe où vient se ranger le brin d'antenne est particulièrement long, de sorte que le boîtier contenant le moteur vient se fixer en bas de la contre-aile, sur une petite patte soudée tout en bas du passage de roue. Cette patte soudée était montée de série (même si la voiture sortait d'usine sans antenne). Toutefois, elle n'est présente que sur les autos produites entre août 1974 et septembre 1976.

A partir d'octobre 1976, les antennes montées sont des 6.000 U (exactement des 6.000 U 462 dans les W116). Le coffrage de ces antennes est toujours entièrement métallique et, il est de nouveau laissé à l'état brut (sans peinture). Apparemment, une garniture spécifique venait cacher l'antenne dans le coffre. Vers 1978, les garnitures de contre-aile ont été modifiées de sorte que la garniture de série intègre un logement pour l'antenne permettant à celle-ci d'être camouflée sans avoir recours à une garniture spécifique additionnelle.
Sur ces Hirschmann 6.000 U, le tube de rangement du brin est très court et la patte tenant le boîtier du moteur vient donc se fixer à la caisse beaucoup plus haut que sur les anciennes 6.000 H.

Je vais tenter de répondre plus particulièrement à tes questions :

1 : les antennes actuelles portant différentes références Mercedes sont semblables mais ont toutes une spécificité qui justifiera une référence particulière, ce peut être au niveau de la fiche de connexion, de la patte de fixation, de la longueur du brin, de la longueur du tube de rangement du brin. Les Hirschmann 6.000 du temps des W116 ne portaient pas encore de référence Mercedes gravée sur le boîtier, mais elles avaient une référence Hirschmann propre. Ainsi, l'Hirschmann 6000U 462 des W116 se distinguait de l'Hirschmann 6000U 461 des W107 par une fiche de connexion et une patte de fixation différente. J'ai déjà converti une 461 pour la monter sur une W116, c'est finalement assez simple.

2 : les antennes 6.000 H des W116 utilisaient des brins de 110 cm et les 6.000 U des brins de 100 cm. Je ne connais pas la longueur des brins des 6.000 EL et KE (les modèles avec boîtier en plastique noir).
Quant aux boîtiers, les EL utilisent des boîtiers de dimensions semblables à ceux des 6.000 U. En revanche, les KE me semblent plus volumineuses et je ne suis pas certain qu'elles puissent être installées derrière la garniture de contre-aile d'une W116.

3 : Les antennes Hirschmann à boîtier métal ne sont plus produites et je ne connais aucune entreprise proposant des modèles reconditionnées en échange standard.

4 : Je ne connais pas de kit de réfection pour ces antennes (en dehors des brins de remplacement). De mon côté, je n'en ai jamais eu besoin, j'ai toujours pu remettre en état mes Hirschmann 6000 sans remplacer aucune autre pièce que le brin.
Même une 6.000 H restée vingt ans dehors dans une casse avec le brin cassé à sa base a pu reprendre vie après un démontage et un nettoyage minutieux (malgré la gangue de boue et de rouille qui entourait les éléments situés en bas du boîtier). Elle est désormais montée sur la 450SEL de mon père et fonctionne correctement, plus lentement que la moyenne mais sans le moindre bruit suspect

5 : Je ne pense pas qu'on puisse transférer les organes d'une Hirschmann récente dans un boîtier ancien, les organes internes sont trop différents. Ou alors, il faut modifier le boîtier, pour supprimer les points de fixation d'origine et en créer de nouveau permettant d'ancrer le nouveau mécanisme.

6 : En dehors des modèles USA, toutes les antennes électriques montées en usine sur les W116 étaient automatiques, donc elles se levaient lorsqu'on allumait la radio et elles redescendaient après l'extinction de celle-ci.
A partir du mois d'août 1974, tous les exemplaires sortaient d'usine avec un câble coaxial d'antenne déjà installé, et le câblage électrique pour la commande de l'antenne. On trouve dans le coffre une fiche de connexion à quatre pôles avec trois câbles à l'intérieur. Le câble rouge est alimenté en + 12 V permanent. Le câble marron est relié à la masse. Le câble bleu doit pouvoir être retrouvé dans l'emplacement de l'autoradio et se brancher sur la borne "+ antenne" ou "+auxiliaire" de l'autoradio.
Quant au branchement de l'antenne sur la fiche de connexion du coffre, il doit être fait de la manière suivante :
- câble rouge antenne sur câble rouge auto
- câble noir antenne sur câble marron auto
- câble blanc antenne sur câble bleu auto

Moyennant quoi, l'antenne doit être commandée par l'allumage et l'extinction de l'autoradio

7 : L'ajustement de la hauteur peut correspondre à deux choses distinctes :

- un montage qui existait sur les modèles USA pour que l'antenne fonctionne en mode semi-automatique, elle était alors commandée par un interrupteur et non par l'autoradio, l'utilisateur pouvait décider de lever partiellement ou complètement l'antenne. En mode automatique, c'est impossible, l'antenne ne peut être que complètement déployée ou complètement rétractée.

- un dispositif interne permettait sur les 6.000 H  de monter des brins de longueur différente, les W116 utilisaient des brins 110 cm mais il était possible de monter également des brins 90 ou 130 cm. Dans, ce cas, il suffisait de modifier la position d'une pièce à l'intérieur du boîtier d'antenne pour ajuster le nombre de tours du moteur à la longueur du brin. Cette possibilité a disparu sur les 6.000 U.

rumb

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #55 on: 24 November 2015, 05:18 AM »
Hirschmann data from a French fanatic; of course, I mentioned here that electric antennas mounted at the factory on the W116, so this eliminates manual antennas, vintage electric antennas installed in props (often Japanese antennas) and antennas mounted later. The electric antennas mounted at the factory on W116 are exclusively Hirschmann 6000 with all-metal housing. From the start of production (1972), until July 1974, these are Hirschmann 6000 H mounted in the right-front fender, the housing is metallic and no particular finish.
From August 1974 until September 1976, the antennas are still 6,000 H but are now mounted in the rear wing-left ( the chest). The housings of these antennas are still metal but they are painted black. Where does the fixed tube to pull the antenna wire is particularly long, so that the housing containing the motor is fixed against the bottom of the wing on a small lug welded to the bottom of the wheel arch. This welded leg was fitted as standard (even if the car out factory without antenna). However, it is only present on cars produced between August 1974 and September 1976. From October 1976 the mounted antennas are 6.000 U (6.000 U of exactly 462 in the W116).
The shuttering of these antennas is always full metal and it is again left to the raw (painting). Apparently, a specific trim had to hide the antenna in the boot. Towards 1978 against the wing-linings were changed so that the gasket includes a series of housing for the antenna allows it to be concealed without using additional specific trim. Of these 6,000 U Hirschmann, the strand of the storage tube is very short and the tab into the motor housing thus is fixed to the body much higher than on the old 6000 H.

I will try to answer your questions more specifically:
1: current antennas wearing different Mercedes references are similar but all have specificity justify particular reference, it may be at the connection plug of the bracket, the length of the strand, the length of the strand storage tube. Hirschmann 6000 time of W116 were not wearing yet Mercedes number stamped on the housing, but they had a clean Hirschmann reference. Thus, the 6000U Hirschmann 462 of W116 differed from W107 Hirschmann 6000U 461 of a connector plug and a different bracket.
 I have already converted 461 for a ride on a W116 is actually quite simple.
2: 6000 H antennas W116 used strands of 110 cm and 6.000 U 100 cm strands. I do not know the length of the strands of the EL 6000 and KE (models with black plastic case). As for the boxes, using dimensions EL boxes similar to those of 6000 U. In contrast, seem larger KE me and I'm not sure they can be installed behind the trim against a wing-W116.
3: metal housing Hirschmann antennae are no longer produced and I know of no company offering reconditioned models remanufactured.
4: I do not know repair kit for these antennas (outside replacement strands). For my part, I have never needed, I could always restore my Hirschmann 6000 without replacing anything other than the strand. Even a 6000 H remained twenty years apart in a broken strand breaks with his Basic was able to resume life after disassembly and thorough cleaning (despite the gangue of mud and rust surrounding the elements at the bottom of the enclosure). It is now mounted on the 450SEL my father and working properly, slower than average, but without the slightest suspicious noise
: I do not think we can transfer the bodies to a recent Hirschmann in an old box, organs internals are too different. Or, you must change the case, to remove the original mounting points and create new to anchor the new mechanism.
6: Outside the US models, all electrical antennas mounted at the factory on the W116 were automatic, so they rose when they turned on the radio and coming back down after the extinction of it. From August 1974 all copies came from the factory with an antenna coaxial cable already installed, and electrical wiring for controlling the antenna. It is found in the trunk a connection plug four pole with three cables inside. The red cable is supplied with + 12 V permanent. Brown wire is connected to ground. The blue wire must be found in the location of the radio and connect to the terminal "+ antenna" or "+ auxiliary" of the receiver.
As for the antenna connection on the trunk connector plug, it must be done as follows: - Red antenna cable red cable car - black antenna cable to brown cable car - white antenna cable to the blue cable car Whereby, the antenna must be controlled by switching on and off the radio
7: The height adjustment can be separate things - a montage that existed on the US model for the antenna to work in semi-automatic mode, it was then controlled by a switch and not by the radio, the user could decide to lift partially or completely the antenna. In automatic mode, it is impossible, the antenna can only be fully extended or fully retracted. - An internal device allowed about 6,000 H to mount strands of different lengths, the W116 using strands 110 cm but it was possible also mount 90 or 130 cm strands. In this case, it was enough to change the position of a part i inside the antenna housing to adjust the number of motor revolutions to the length of the strand. This possibility has disappeared about 6,000 U.
'68 250S, '77 6.9 euro, '91 300SE, '98 SL500 '14 CLS550

rumb

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #56 on: 24 November 2015, 05:56 AM »
Back to flagstaffs, I finally ran into the diagram again under 116.036,  #81 equipment interior appointments, 56012 flagstaff.

Rod is 1208100084 listed as available at dealer for $192.40  http://www.mboemparts.com/oe-mercedes-benz/1208100084

fixture 1108100081 $46.62
'68 250S, '77 6.9 euro, '91 300SE, '98 SL500 '14 CLS550

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #57 on: 24 November 2015, 09:43 PM »
 :o :o :o :o!!

UTn_boy

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #58 on: 25 November 2015, 02:09 AM »
But don't forget.....you'll also need the rubber pads that go between the fixture holder and the fender, part number 110-818-00-97, (about $6.00 each), you'll need the backing plate that goes on the inside of the fender, part number 110-818-00-16, ($31 each), and, of course the nuts and lock washers that hold it to the fender....part numbers N009021-005205 (need 4), N912004-005103 (need 4), and N000934-005008, (need 4).  We used to be able to buy the "range of delivery", which was a kit that included everything.  When I ordered my last two kits, I was told there were only 4 kits left.  I got two of them, and I imagine Classic pulled the remaining two to stash away never to be seen again. 

However, you must be ok with drilling holes in your fenders.  It's the only way they mount.  A lot of people get the flag staffs and the parking poles mixed up and think they're one in the same.  They may look similar, but both have different purposes and both also mount in different places.....with the parking poles mounted on the bumpers. 

In order to correctly mount the flag staffs, you'll have to refer to the "Special Equipment" book for W116 cars.  It'll have a template that you can photo copy and use, or you can simply use measurements if you are good with taking measurements. 
1966 250se coupe`, black/dark green leather
1970 600 midnight blue/parchment leather
1971 300sel 6.3, papyrus white/dark red leather
1973 300sel 4.5, silver blue metallic/blue leather
1976 280s astral silver/blue MB Tex
1978 450sel 6.9 Euro, Anthr/velour

floyd111

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Re: Option list W116 - The full Monty!
« Reply #59 on: 25 November 2015, 07:23 AM »
Good to have that clarified.
I kinda left the flagpole idea behind for ethical reasons, aesthetic reasons, and the drilling part.
I DID however corner the Japanese market for MB-supplied vintage corner poles. I got a nice fat collection of them here now, all 7 pairs of them, born as poles for other old Benzes, R107, W126 and W124. They will be refurbished brand new, and put up for sale for the org members. They will have custom-made non-invasive, straight-fit mounting brackets for W116, for Euro bumpers.
I managed to get 2 pairs with lights inside the top MB logo, that connect to the head light switch. No complaints possible from the fashionista, coz they came in an official MB box. No matter they were MB Japan-only. They're MB still.