Author Topic: Odd intermittent starter noise  (Read 838 times)

TJ 450

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #15 on: 29 April 2020, 08:28 PM »
You could look at the ring gear through the access cover at the lower rear of the bell housing.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500

revilla

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #16 on: 29 April 2020, 10:03 PM »
I had the same problem, was a loose mounting bolt.

That would cause the symptoms too as the bendix gear would try to engage the flywheel but not quite reaching it, essentially turning in the air. However this failure mode would be independent of air temperature. On the other hand, the wobbling  bendix due to bad brass insert or bad clutch/bearings would happen rather during cold days only as the grease is then harder making the clutch sticky.

Cheers
Robert
W116 1977 280SEL & 1979 280SE

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #17 on: 29 April 2020, 10:15 PM »
Thanks guys I'm planning on pulling off this bad boy in the next couple of days.  Will try and post pics of my findings.
Cheers
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #18 on: 30 April 2020, 08:15 PM »
OK she's out, delivered the baby with not too much drama, not easy but doable with front end jacked up and secured.

But now, how the hell do you get the bendix out..?  Please tell me you don't have to strip the entire starter :o
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

TJ 450

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #19 on: 30 April 2020, 09:57 PM »
I hate to say it, but I'm pretty certain you do. It's entirely up to you of course, but I would consider taking it to an auto electrician/ Bosch agent for evaluation or servicing.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500

revilla

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #20 on: 30 April 2020, 10:15 PM »
Remove the C clip at the front of the axle.  Remove the 3 solenoid screws.  Remove back case (2 screws).  Remove central little metal cover protecting the back tip of the axle. Tap axle backwards. Check looseness/wobble of bendix and the functionality of the clutch moving in only 1 direction with relative rotations to the axle. Confirm therefore the failure mode. Remove old bendix. Install new one in reverse order.  Do not try to simply grease up and re-assembly.  If your central brass insert if worn you will have the same symptoms which will force you to do the job twice.

By the way, you ordered and received the new bendix in record time.  Maybe MB dealers are functioning over there.
Robert
W116 1977 280SEL & 1979 280SE

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #21 on: 30 April 2020, 10:23 PM »
Thanks guys.

Revilla I do not think the M100 starter is the same as the one might have worked on?  The Bendix you referenced is not for the M100 engine.  I actually had this Bendix from way back, I bought it on a whim a while ago.

I think some of your tips will be the same on this starter, but I fear I will need to strip the thing out completely as Tim has mentioned.  Ugh I can see this going sideways...
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

revilla

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #22 on: 30 April 2020, 10:30 PM »
The tips given above are for your starter.  Not a big deal to replace the little bendix.  But check its functionality before you remove it.  That will ensure you're fixing the actual problem.
Robert
W116 1977 280SEL & 1979 280SE

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #23 on: 30 April 2020, 11:52 PM »
OK thanks I was able to strip out the main shaft, but now I still cannot figure out how to take off the current Bendix?  My brain is fried I'm off to bed, maybe it'll come to me in a dream ::)
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #24 on: 01 May 2020, 09:25 AM »
OK so sadly it did not come to me in a dream and feels like a nightmare now :-\  I cannot for the life of me figure out how to release the Bendix from the main shaft, any takers?
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

revilla

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #25 on: 01 May 2020, 09:38 AM »
Hi Daniel,

The clutch/gear assembly is spring loaded. With the core/axle assy standing, if you slide the gear down you should expose a black C shaped clip near the tip of the shaft.  Once visible, it needs to come off. It’s hard as it’s press fitted.  I have used a thin but strong screwdriver to force it out. Careful it will jump so place a rag around so you don’t lose it. It might get deformed, but it doesn’t matter. We’ll get it in shape during reassembly, which is probably the hardest part of all, but doable don’t worry.

Alternatively, check the opposite tip for a similar C clip. You can slide core + clutch/gear assy downwards.
Robert
W116 1977 280SEL & 1979 280SE

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #26 on: 01 May 2020, 09:40 AM »
Here is another pic, showing the new and old Bendix.  Appears the new one is "integrated" whereas the old one has a type of spacer, however it appears to be fused to the unit and not a separate washer, thus the 2 "bearings" have the same thickness.

Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

TJ 450

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #27 on: 01 May 2020, 09:52 AM »
Nice work,

That doesn't look all that scary which is definitely a good thing. Hopefully this will sort it out.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #28 on: 01 May 2020, 09:52 AM »
Hi Daniel,

The clutch/gear assembly is spring loaded. With the core/axle assy standing, if you slide the gear down you should expose a black C shaped clip near the tip of the shaft.  Once visible, it needs to come off. It’s hard as it’s press fitted.  I have used a thin but strong screwdriver to force it out. Careful it will jump so place a rag around so you don’t lose it. It might get deformed, but it doesn’t matter. We’ll get it in shape during reassembly, which is probably the hardest part of all, but doable don’t worry.

Alternatively, check the opposite tip for a similar C clip. You can slide core + clutch/gear assy downwards.

Thanks Robert, I am still confused, heck I am feeling so dumb on this seemingly easy task, ugh :o  When you say push down, I cannot see that the bendix unit wants to move down further than in the "pulled back" (solenoid off) position, unless you really have to put a lot of weight on it?  And then where to apply force, on the large bearing?
Also, where is the C Clip, is it at the very top under the chrome cap?
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

daantjie

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Re: Odd intermittent starter noise
« Reply #29 on: 01 May 2020, 10:20 AM »
Sorry to clog up the board with this little caper fellas, but I am updating as I get more frustrated with hopeful resolution, maybe other can learn from my shenanigans ;D

Robert, maybe I am getting confused with "up" and "down" relatively speaking.  When I stand the shaft up (90 degrees), with the cog/teeth of the bendix on the bench, then I am pulling the large ring unit down towards the bench against the force of the spring.  Then I see a groove where I guess a snap ring would sit, but I do not see any snap ring there.  If I pull it down further I see a ring/crown of sorts with the small ball bearings visible, so I am not sure if I need to keep pulling it down even further?  The spring is quite firm of course so it won't be easy to keep pulling it down?  I would post a pic but I need both hands to pull the large ring down towards the bench.
« Last Edit: 01 May 2020, 10:31 AM by daantjie »
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber