Hi guys,
I'm currently restoring a 1978 28CE that I saved from a slow death at the hands of a novice.
The car looks to have been well looked after by the previous unknown owner.
But in the space of 8 months the young lass that I bought it from had just about ruined it.
It was in a real mess, wet Lucern hay in the boot, chicken pellets on the back seat, hamburger wrappers all over the floor, the car was leaking fuel from a torn pipe under the tank and when I checked the oil the young female exclaimed " oh, that's where the oil goes" The dip stick was dry, but the engine still had oil pressure.
When I got it home the first thing I did was drain the oil, only about 1 litre of black muck came out.
But after a full lube change and a clean the little M110 motor ticks away like clockwork. Testament to Mercedes Engineering.
Anyhow Question:
Does anyone have experience in removing all the "anti pollution " crap that was imposed on the Australian imported cars of that era.
#In particular the plumbing that feed into the exhaust ports in the head,
#will I need to do anything with the timing.
#any other helpful hints will be greatly appreciated.
Regards
Robert
Cleanest way to eliminate the "smog pump" is to source a set of Euro M110 exhaust manifolds from the same era. They show up from time-to-time on eBay and are probably most easily found on eBay.de. Sadly, like most exhaust manifolds, they're cast iron, which means a ton of money to ship downunder.
That being said, removal is as simple as removing the piping and plugging the holes. I'm not sure what thread pattern is used, but in a pinch, the threaded bushings that hold the pipes to the manifolds could be welded shut after being cut free of the pipes. Depending on how they seal to the manifold, they might have to be machined to create the proper sealing profile, as no sealant I'm aware of will last for long on the threads of anything screwed into an exhaust manifold.
As for changing the timing, I'm not certain removal of the air injection system will make any difference. The main purpose of the system was to add additional oxygen to the exhaust system to increase the efficiency of the catalytic converter (if so equipped) and to allow for a more thorough combustion cycle. Exhaust gases exiting the cylinder in a cold engine are usually very rich and the only reason combustion doesn't continue is all the oxygen has been used - adding more allows the exhaust gasses to burn up as much extra fuel as possible. On later MB's (my former '92 W140 car as an example), the air pumps have a clutch like an A/C compressor and only run for a specific amount of time after a cold engine tickover.
If the car is equipped with catalytic converters, removing them is probably your best bet, but I've heard tales of lower back pressure resulting in lower torque at rpms just above idle. Newer high-flow catalysts are excellent replacements and you do your part to help seal the hole in the ozone...
Others will have better ideas, I'm sure - these are mine.
Regards
Ive removed all the smog gear from my 280, due to the fact the pump was seized and all the associated piping was in poor condition.
Like spoken of before a set of non egr headers is the way forward, or blank off the egr with a blank plate.
When you remove the headers you can then unbolt the air injection rail.Youll be pleased to know that you can kindly 'butcher' the rail for the six union fittings that only need a 5c coin inserting into which forms a blank.This stops any exhaust gas leaking through the injection ports.
Remove all the pipework and valves that runs around and under the harmonic balancer to the pump.Remove the pump bracket as well for extra weight saving.
With all the smog gear and EGR vac lines disconnected, you can downsize your vac system to a minimum.Because i have no A/C i have only one vac line.This is the advance line from the Distributor to the lower portion of the intake.You'll work out what you can junk ;)
Regarding the timing im running 0* TDC, i have experimented like many other Mb owners though.Its all down to personal choice.I had an earlier style air filter housing(Snout running across cam box and piped across the exhaust headers to the front), i swapped this for a later styled air housing from a w126 which has the forward facing snout direct.This should help the car take in cooler air more effeciently(sorry poor grammar).Ive been running on 5/40 oil as well for some time now.My car has half a milllion K's on it, so hey its having a 'red bull' moment.
Let us know how you get on. ;D
Welcome back!
My son has a 280 CE, what we quickly learned is that the 280 engine despite it being pretty (in a macsuline way that is, spit!) is a pain to work on, somehow everything is underneath something else, don't know how they managed that. M100 are a joy to work on by comparison
After a little work it goes well, very well, still has a cold running problem that needs further work, needs to warm up for 3 or 4 minutes before it has any power.
As far as the pollution gear goes, the air injection into the exhaust manifold is not a problem, apart from the air pump rattling, I'd leave that as it is. EGR is a problem though, if only because it deposits all sorts of rubbish on the inlet side of the engine. To keep the stock look I'd leave all the plumbing intact and block off the the exhaust manifold where the EGR valve mounts with a piece of stainless steel.
BTW, He just took delivery of one of those ebay AMG cam box covers that was discussed some time ago.
koan
Thanks for your input guys, I have taken note and have started with the de-cluter. All the old vac pipe are gone, the air pump gone, the air con pump and hoses gone ( car has a sun roof ).
and a donor car (1973 280SE) (A Real Barn Find with birds nest in the battery cradle and rats nesting in the spark plug valleys ) has happened to come along at the right moment. It has the early exhaust headers free of all the ADR stuff. so I will transplant them after a good clean. Its motor has the earlier type fuel injection,
I have also gone hunting at the wreckers and located a later model air filter housing so I done away with the original over the top snorkel. in affect my goal is to totally stream line the engine bay.
I should take some before and after photos before its too late.
Cheers
Robert
Here is how i did it:
http://forum.w116.org/mechanicals/warped-solex/15/
Robert
Hey Stork,
Nice job, I really like the look of the Euro Headers but I don't think they will fit a RHD car cause the steering box will be in the way.
Cheers
Robert D
I believe the euro headers on the right hand drive car are different. I think its called the Y pipe headers (someone correct me...) Anyway just wanted you to see that it is pretty straight forward removing all the smog stuff (but a bit of a pain in the arse) If yours has the A/C you are going to have to remove the compressor as well. I have heard of others hollowing out the cat but supposedly it makes a terrible noise if you do that.
Good luck on the conversion!
Robert
My car has these headers fitted
Im not sure what spec car they are of.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g119/meadowginger/280SE_ex_manifold_c-1.jpg)
These are the ones with the Y piece.
Theres no cat on my car.
The pic above is the standard arrangement for 280S/SE euro spec, right hand drive. No emission control equipt.
I have attmpted to upload photos, but I cannot find the upload icon anywhere on the gallery page? help please
Rob
Quote from: robertd on 21 May 2011, 02:51 AM
I have attmpted to upload photos, but I cannot find the upload icon anywhere on the gallery page? help please
Rob
Rob every now and they I find i have to log out and log back in for the upload options to appear. Not sure why this is.
robertd,
Pls confirm you VIN number so I can get you at least the correct p/n numbers for the non emission headers and maybe even check if they are still available from MB.
Tks,
Joe
Thanks Japes, I logged out and all is good again.
Photos to come
The 280CE engine bay
Work in progress to De-Clutter
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/29432-1/IMGP3480.JPG)
This is What it looked like before I stated
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/29422-1/low+res.jpg)
I'm not that into gassers but that split exhaust on the straight 6 is pretty d@mned awesome 8) Those are just nice looking engines.
Maybe I'm getting into gassers :o
hey Joe,
the vin is 123 053 22 012197
Regards
Rob
Some of the stuff removed from the coupe
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/29426-1/IMGP3483.JPG)
the coupe had self leveling rear suspension ?
awesome, never knew that was even an option on those.
Rob,
Thought maybe EPC would give me your engine number based on the VIN but no joy... pls confirm engine number as there are several supercessions of p/n's for the manifolds.
Tks a lot,
Joe
The Barn find coupe in the pits
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/29450-1/IMGP3476_001.JPG)
hey Joe
engine # 110 984 22 047670
Rob
Hi Rob,
Congratulations on your purchase! I have been through the same issues with the W126, and feel your pain! Actually I recall we looked at some manifolds at your place a while back when i mentioned I was going to dump the EGR but they had the port on them, for the W116 at least.
The ADR27 compliant M110 engines for Australia contain the following emission items:
1. Charcoal canister to absorb fuel vapour from the inlet system.
2. Exhaust gas recirculation to reduce combustion temperature and therefore NOx emissions
3. Smog pump to facilitate secondary combustion in the exhaust manifolds to reduce CO
4. I am NOT certain about 1978 models, but the car may possibly have the 3/4 ignition retard vacuum switch which is energised when the transmission selects 3rd. or 4th.
5. Ignition timing set to 2 degrees ATDC.
6. 8.0:1 compression ration instead of the Euro 9.0:1.
I am doing this from memory, but in case I've left something off, I have the Australian 1978 Workshop Manual Emissions Equipment Australian supplement. I'll bring it down one Sunday in the next few weeks, how does that sound? (I'm currently in Penang which is why I haven't called since the concour!!)
You can see a pic of the emission junk I took off the W126 here:
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W126/280SEsmog-1.jpg)
Not shown is the EGR valve and air injection rail for the head.
Note, with the W126, all RHD W126's had the EGR valve mount, I bought a second set of manifolds and welded up the hole, you can see them here, before and after:
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W126/L1070485-1.jpg)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W126/L1070488-1.jpg)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W126/L1070497.jpg)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W126/L1070495.jpg)
I have yet to ceramic coat them, next project!!
If you are going to the trouble, make sure you use the twin system, rather than replace with the "Y" piece. I think no Australian W123 had the "Y" piece anyway, but I could be wrong.
A couple of tips. The EGR injection line in the inlet manifold is the same as the oil drain plug in a Ferrari 308, they are cheap on ebay if you want to plug it nicely. And do make sure you plug not only the manifold inlet, but the air cleaner port where the compressor gets its air from.
Anyway, once you have plugged the holes, re-time the engine, you should be able to run at least 4 degrees before TDC but you must run 95 RON fuel minimum. Note, the fuel consumption went from 20 mpg on the W126 to an amazing 27 mpg after I ditched the gear and re-timed it.
I'm just running out the door and perhaps I've forgotten something, but I'll let you know, otherwise lets see if we can meet up in the next few weeks.
Regards,
Carl.
Rob,
With regards to the exhaust ports in the head, my plan is simply to remove the injection rail, cut the female threads off and weld up the hole in the thread then screw the threaded section back on. I am assuming it will be very difficult to remove the threaded insert already in the head, but I cannot be sure.
Presently on the 126, the rail is still fitted, just blanked off at the check valve end. I just can't stand seeing it fitted, however I left it in place figuring I'd do the rail, and the manifolds together.
Regards,
Carl.
Quote from: 1980sdga on 22 May 2011, 07:45 PM
I'm not that into gassers but that split exhaust on the straight 6 is pretty d@mned awesome 8) Those are just nice looking engines.
Maybe I'm getting into gassers :o
They are, especially when there is no pollution shite fitted:
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W116/L1040236-1.jpg)
Here we go Rob, this is what you have to aim for:
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W116/enginepicbrochure-1.jpg)
Just noticed, a nice set of left hand drive exhaust manifolds.
does anyone know how much a set of manifolds will cost me? I have a crack somewhere in my exhaust or such that is making my old girl sound a bit of a tractor ;) - not to mention the old manifolds are rusted and rather ugly to view!
jjb,
Sometimes you can find used manifolds in good condition, if not pls post your VIN and I can check price and availability at the Classic Center.
Tks,
Joe
Hi Carl,
Good to hear from you, I was hoping you would engage with this topic.
I was lucky enough to find a set of early exhaust headers from the donor 280SE that found me.
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/29787-2/IMGP3522.JPG)
the top ones are out of the coupe I'm restoring the bottom ones are going to be installed after being cleaned up. what would you recommend.
The pictures of your award winning 280 engine bay are an inspiration.
Here is a set of power steering lines from a 450SE (the pumpkin)rest it's soul, they run along the fire wall behind the motor, I'm going to try to change them over from the ones that run across the front top of the 6 cylinder motor to help streamline the engine bay. just like the sample photo you posted Carl.
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/29793-2/IMGP3524.JPG)
These are the offending pipes I want to re-route
(http://gallery.w116.org/dl/29801-2/IMGP3529.JPG)
Hi Rob,
You've been busy I see. You have lovely pipes!
Have you thought about having the manifolds ceramic coated? I am not sure if you would wish to go down that route if you are not going to keep the car long term but they do look nice and don't rust.
Having said that, a friend painted some manifolds with a can of VHT paint in white, and they still look great after a few years. It took an hour to wire brush them and about $20 for the paint. Might be worth a shot.
The power steering lines at the front of the early M110 engines are an eyesore. I would love to re-route mine, but my problem with that white car is its originality, so I'll keep it that way.
The pumpkin has been good to us RIP, thanks pumpkin for the wheels.
Regards,
Carl.
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W116/280sew116wheeladventure10-1.jpg)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W116/280sew116wheeladventure4-1.jpg)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W116/280sew116wheeladventure7-1.jpg)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n281/carl308888/Mercedes-Benz%20280%20SE%20W116/280sew116wheeladventure8-1.jpg)
Quick question, does the vac operated seat back locking operate on your CEs Rob?
koan
The seat vac locking system is not working in either car.
I have removed the front seat in the new arrival and found the vac line melted at the end to stop it shut.
Rob
Good evening all, I don't know how old this thread is but just came across it, I have a 1978 Mercedes 280ce that requires the front end exhaust downpipe, its very difficult to get hold of one even Mercedes do not stock them anymore. The manifold on mine is exactly the type shown on this restoration it goes down to a Y piece into a single and back out to a Y piece to meet the centre pipe. What I want to find out is if I change the two manifolds to the other type that comes out at a slight angle so I can put in the two separate pipes and possibly put in another centre exhaust if needs be but I need to get rid of the downpipe its gone beyond welding.
im doing up my 280te at present, these are the manifolds I just got back. I went with the metal grey.
Quote from: nathan on 17 March 2019, 07:22 AM
im doing up my 280te at present, these are the manifolds I just got back. I went with the metal grey.
Looking forward to see what the rest of the restoration be like with the finish on them really good finish .