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Just secured a 450 SEL 6.9 after bit of a chase (years)

Started by andrewk, 18 October 2022, 07:38 AM

andrewk

Yesterday was a public holiday here. As I don't participate in that day, I decided to work on the 6.9.

Unfortunately it was ~35*C so the work was strenuous (see picture) and many of the parts refused to budge, caked on with mud, rust and general old age. Far less work than expected was completed.

I did however manage to get the driver's side rear brakes installed - new parking brake shoes were extraordinarily tedious to install.
The brake discs were also really hard to remove as they were completely rusted to the wheel hub.

The rear left brake disc is stuck due to a jammed parking brake shoe - i'll have to disconnect the cable or use a puller on the brake disc.

In addition, I received a huge box of parts from MB Classic Center in the USA after it was stuck with FedEx for the best part of a week. New water pump, loads of plastic and rubber pieces, some bolts, a master cylinder, the correct clear hose for the headlight and windscreen washer system, loads of vacuum tubing and various other items.

I'm away for a few days so i'll try get some work in on Monday night, replacing some of the vacuum hoses and other pieces which connect to the fuel / injection system.

1979 450 SEL 6.9 (#5532) - silbergrün metallic

BCK1963

As far as I have been able to track there are two of these sway bar bushings left at a german MB dealer. He refuses to sell as this dealer is part of the MB classic line and he says he needs the bushings for an upcoming restoration.
However, he says as well that he will have them reproduced to OEM standards. It may take a couple of weeks and the price indication is appr. 50 € plus tax. But don't nail me on details.

I will keep you posted on how things will proceed.
Bernd

1976 Merc 6.9   Magnetit blue

revilla

Quote from: andrewk on 26 January 2023, 06:08 PMThat's around $400 AUD once delivered. A bit too expensive - I don't really buy into scalping.


I think you probably meant to write:
"Thank you very much Rumb. I appreciate the time you spent to find this option for me. However, it might be a bit too expensive for me being based in Australia. But thanks anyway. This forum and its members are of great help. They lend a hand every time out of good will. Nice to be part of it.

Gratitude is a fundamental principle of this forum.
Robert
W116 1977 280SEL & 1979 280SE
[img width=150 height=100][url="http://revillagodfroy.com/MB%201977%20280%20SEL/album/thumbs/IMG_0371.JPG"]http://revillagodfroy.com/MB%201977%20280%20SEL/album/thumbs/IMG_0371.JPG[/url][/img]

McNuggets

ECS Tuning seems to have them for about $40 each. I was going to buy these in November but their website was acting up and I was worried about missing out so I bought from MBOEMparts for $60/ea. Can't remember if I bought fronts yet or not...

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-mercedes-benz-parts/mounttorsio/1163261381/

rumb

I tried ordering some 2 weeks ago from a dealer and they said nla.


Ecs and most parts sites have no idea if a part is nla until after you order.
'68 250S
'77 6.9 Euro
'91 300SE,
'98 SL500
'14 CLS550,
'16 AMG GTS

Randys01

gee that w pump looks the goods.I can feel money talking here!

W116120


andrewk

Quote from: revilla on 27 January 2023, 01:27 AM
Quote from: andrewk on 26 January 2023, 06:08 PMThat's around $400 AUD once delivered. A bit too expensive - I don't really buy into scalping.


I think you probably meant to write:
"Thank you very much Rumb. I appreciate the time you spent to find this option for me. However, it might be a bit too expensive for me being based in Australia. But thanks anyway. This forum and its members are of great help. They lend a hand every time out of good will. Nice to be part of it.

Gratitude is a fundamental principle of this forum.

Actually, I wouldn't write such a message. I believe in honesty and directness as the basis of interaction with all people, even if that comes across as blunt - or even so much rude, at times - although being rude isn't my intention, this has been a useful trait that has taken me far in life and I expect the same from other people.  It cuts out a lot of time wasted, and gets to the important details and meaningful interactions faster. In this instance, I could have stated that I already had looked at this listing via a part number search and been recommended this exact listing on eBay several times which would have given context to the other part of my comment. I'll work on that in the future, as I realise there is only so much that can be communicated in plain English text without the nuance of vocal delivery.

It isn't that I don't appreciate the assistance - which should be clear by the nature of my posting here, as I think I am at least making a small, but useful contribution to the vast wealth of information that is on this site as a way of "returning the favour". I believe in displaying gratitude by action, not just by words. Anyhow.

50 Euro is a reasonable amount for a quality part of this kind, Bernd. If I could get some originals i'd also take a mould and convert this to a Solidworks drawing - a request for a technical drawing from MB Classic was futile.

Any tips for removing a jammed rear brake disc without buying a 3 arm puller tool? It is free of the hub, but basically jammed onto the parking brake shoes. I'm going to be working on the car again tomorrow and really want to get the whole rear braking system re-assembled so I can start on the installation of front brakes later this week. Oh, and a nice coating of Copper-based anti seize on all the steel to steel contact parts which are likely to stick themselves together over the next decade (or 3 months).
1979 450 SEL 6.9 (#5532) - silbergrün metallic

andrewk

A little bit of time spent waiting for parts and a weekend away in the country delayed some work on the car.

I wish Mercedes published a description of their bolts other than "bolt" (e.g. M12 x 40 mm x 1.0 - 10.9 Zinc) so I didn't have to remove something from the car, go to the bolt shop then reinstall some time later, or wait for an order from Würth or worse, Mercedes.

So, i'm going to start a catalogue of the bolts, their locations and size (and indicative torque value with a technical reasoning) - coupled with a cross reference to MB part numbers, which in many cases are no longer available. Such was the case for the differential mount to chassis bolts, only two were available at the time of purchase. They come pre-coated with a thread locking compound and should not be re-used after removal, especially when used on drivetrain, suspension or braking system mountings. The bolts from the differential to the mount were a whopping $29 USD/piece from Mercedes Classic. Around 3x what a typical high tensile (10.9/ ASTM A490,A354, Grade 8D) bolt might cost.

So, I have re-assembled the fuel system, the refurbished rear suspension valve, installed a new differential mount and serviced the differential. I carefully cleaned out the brake fluid reservoir which had a lot of black disintegrated rubber particles in it. It is very important that these particles don't end up in the callipers or master cylinder. They are likely from the seals to the master cylinder and also the seal inside the cap. I have a replacement master cylinder to install once the system is flushed out with plenty of ATE SL brake fluid.

The process to clean the tank was as follows:

Emptied old brake fluid (yuck), flushed with small quantities of absolute ethanol until blue dye from fluid was removed, used a degreaser compound (Decon 90) on the inside and out with warm water (fill, shake and drain a few times).
Then I carefully used acetone on a long cotton bud to directly remove the black stuff which was accessible. Following that, I filled and rinsed several times with deionised, ultrafiltered water, several times with the absolute ethanol, then blew out the housing with compressed air, left to air dry. I'll check the float switches with a multimeter and replace the lid which is still available from ATE (PN: 0004315433 - 64), as are the two grommets (PN: 0004310950).

1979 450 SEL 6.9 (#5532) - silbergrün metallic

rumb

'68 250S
'77 6.9 Euro
'91 300SE,
'98 SL500
'14 CLS550,
'16 AMG GTS

andrewk

Quote from: rumb on 05 February 2023, 09:41 AMThere is a DIN survey that list all hardware.

I have a digital copy if anyone is interested.


https://www.authenticclassics.com/Illustrated-DIN-Survey-DIN-Part-Number-Conversion-p/auth-006028.htm



MB part numbering explained

https://www.benzworld.org/threads/mercedes-benz-part-numbering-system.1825929/


Thanks Rumb - very helpful. The bolts in some cases are extremely expensive.

"steering knuckle screws A1269902501: $123.75 incl GST each, Germany. A1239900701: $105.00 incl GST, Nil stock Germany."
That's from a local MB dealer. Unsure how bolts could be that expensive... they are not surgical screws or aerospace grade parts.
1979 450 SEL 6.9 (#5532) - silbergrün metallic

rumb

A1269902501 $24 here from MB

A1239900701 $35 here.

Need help procuring?
'68 250S
'77 6.9 Euro
'91 300SE,
'98 SL500
'14 CLS550,
'16 AMG GTS

andrewk

Quote from: rumb on 09 February 2023, 09:10 AMA1269902501 $24 here from MB

A1239900701 $35 here.

Need help procuring?

Hi Rumb,

I have sourced the parts needed from MB Classic Center. It just takes a little longer to back-and-forth communicate with the USA unless I contact them very early in the day (before 8am).
Thank you for your offer.

Given it is quite difficult to remove the front brake discs without affecting the wheel bearings (I needed to use blowtorch), I decided to replace the bearings at the same time and give the hubs a clean, remove the rust and re-paint with a satin finish black as per original. I left the old bearing races in to protect that surface while I was cleaning. As with many jobs on the car, one small task turns into a lot bigger task. I'd rather do it properly than have to dismantle the whole thing again - given I don't have a hydraulic press and it was already a lot of work to get the hub and brake discs apart - also requiring the assistance of a local mechanic who had suitable tools to push/pull the bearing races.







1979 450 SEL 6.9 (#5532) - silbergrün metallic

daantjie

Pro tip for races.  You can use a punch to drive them out from the back and then use the old race to drive in the new one.  Mostly this is for shade tree techs like myself ;D
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber

rumb

Front bearing play is .001-.002mm.  A dial indicator on a magnetic stand works great to do this. Both are inexpensive to procure (at least in USA)
'68 250S
'77 6.9 Euro
'91 300SE,
'98 SL500
'14 CLS550,
'16 AMG GTS