fantasy project

[bahnstormer109]

Hi Guys,

ive posted this same post in the ozbenz forum, so sorry to those of us who frequent both for the repitition, but was wanting to pick the brains of the 116 enthusiasts here too.

im wondering if anyone would know if you could take the motor and gearbox out of a 126 500SEL and put it in a 116 450SEL??

would it just go in without any modifications? theyre both M117 motors so i assume that they could be interchangeable?

no, im not planning on attacking the new 450, but its actually been ticking over in my mind for a while now. the cam covers on the 500 are ribbed and the ones on the 450 are not but wouldnt this be the only visual difference on the car?
could you swap the old 450 cam covers onto the 500 motor or wouldnt they fit?

is the 500 motor lighter than the 450?
a 450SE would be a tad lighter than a SEL and if the 500 motor is a bit lighter too a 450SE 5.0 could be a bit of a weapon.

if say, you had a 450 116 with a blown motor, instead of popping in another 450 motor, could you 'accidently' pop in a 500 with 4 speed box instead?

food for thought,
cheers,
Paolo.

[bahnstormer109]

Hi Patrick/ Big Richard,

thanks for the comments.

this is a project id seriously consider doing as blown-up 116s and 500 motors are cheap.

i just like the idea of a 4 speed 116 with a 500 in it. if i know its possible to do easily i may keep my eye out for a bargain 116 with a dodgy motor one day...

ive also toyed with the idea of a 108 280SE 3.5 -> 280SE 5.0. would bridge the gap between the 3.5 and the 6.3. i see 108 3.5s going cheap as projects with motors that have dropped their chains etc.

as for just getting a 500SEL, as theyre all imports in australia im not a fan of them. theyre often rusty and often wrecked for parts, so i figure a motor and gearbox wouldnt be hard to find. all the 500SELs ive ever seen have been dungers. im yet to see a nice one.

ive never modified a car before and im not really a fan of it, but if a 116 or 108 is going to be wrecked anyway, it might be a fun way to give it a second chance.

its not like id put a ford motor in it or something!

id consider it a "discreet upgrade", just a bit more of what was already there before.

cheers,
Paolo.

[Des]

....then put the car on a diet, light weight panels from the American 300SD, better yet get them made up in fiberglass,

3:45 ratio diff and then head off to the drag strip.

[s class]

bahnstormer, I personally know a guy here who had a W126 420SE.  The engine was shot, and rather than go through the cost of rebuilding the aluminium block with fancy bore coatings, he popped in an engine and gearbox out of a 450SLC.  I know this is like the 'inverse' of the conversion you have in mind, but he seemed to get it done without any major problems. 

The 500 engine is great, but just be aware that there are two versions - the pre- and post- 1986.  The late post '86 ones I know are very expensive to overhaul, but if maintained properly very rarely give problems.  So just make sure you get a good 500, as you really don't want to overhaul it.  Have you considered a 560 if yo want the ultimate M117?

Ryan

[oscar]

Have you considered a 560 if yo want the ultimate M117?

I can't quote anything figures but I have a recollection of Styria saying something a long time ago about the desmogged 500 engine was slightly more powerfull than the emision restricted 560.  Then again, I suppose in a transplant situation the 560 could be run without the extra gear making it the top of the 126 engines. I dunno, I know nuthin' 

Any merit in those thoughts?

[alabbasi]

Hey Guys, I'm not sure about this; but I met a guy in the mid 90's (back int he day when a 500SEL was worth something) who used to put 450SEL engines into 500SEL. The conversions were worth while as the 500SEL engines still cost thousands.

The 300SD model has an aluminum hood and trunk lid and not fibreglass.

The Euro 500SEL had 240hp the US 560SEL had 227hp and the Euro 560SEL had 300hp.

[oscar]

The Euro 500SEL had 240hp the US 560SEL had 227hp and the Euro 560SEL had 300hp.

227hp - 300hp.  That's incredible for the same engine.  Thanks alabbasi.  Isn't the 500 esentially the same engine too but with smaller bore or stroke?

I think Des was saying to have panels fabricated from fibreglass as an alternative to the original 300sd aluminium ones.  Not sure I'd like too much fibreglass on a 116.  Then again the AMG spoiler looks tops and blends in well.  Speaking of which, I want a red spoiler for the 280 now.  Even the paint finish seems to have the same sheen/shine as the rest of the body.  Maybe a fibreglass hood would pass for looking original.

[Des]

The 300SD model has an aluminum hood and trunk lid and not fibreglass.

Yeah I meant you could have them custom made out of fiberglass, like drag racers do to lighten up their cars.

[AMG69]

My AMG spoiler is sensational!

[koan]

My AMG spoiler is sensational! ;D

Bet mine's bigger than yours ;)

k

[alabbasi]

I have a spare aluminum 300SD hood and trunk lid that I was going to put on my old 78 Euro 6.9 as both panels on that car were very rusty. I ended up selling the car.

I've seen cars with fibreglass panels on them. They end up sitting very high, like the way a car sits when the engine is removed because of the reduced weight of the fibreglass.

I think Des was saying to have panels fabricated from fibreglass as an alternative to the original 300sd aluminium ones.  Not sure I'd like too much fibreglass on a 116.

[alabbasi]

These days most US spec cars have fibreglass parts such as fenders, hoods and quarters. I don't think it makes them less safe. The strength is built into the structure and not the panels.

I'm not sure how easy fibreglass is to repair.

[Mforcer]

I'm not sure how easy fibreglass is to repair.

Fibreglass is very easy to repair... just think of all the boats made of fibreglass that need the occasional body work.