Author Topic: 280SE conversion from SLS to springs. Looking for a particular thread/info  (Read 5775 times)

chrismsullivan

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Hi everyone.

I've been searching around and noticed quite a few posts making reference to a thread of an SLS to springs conversion on a 280SE. After considerable searching, I can't find it.

I'm very interested in the thread as I'm toying with the idea af disabling my SLS. Can anyone provide a link to the thread?

I know basically what's involved in the process, but would like to learn more.

« Last Edit: 27 August 2011, 05:09 PM by chrismsullivan »
1976 W116 280SE - Project car
1969 W108 280SE - So sad I sold it in a fit of stupid youthiness.
1970 W108 280S - Project car - GONE!
MY08 Subaru Liberty - Daily faithful
2007 B6 TDi VW Passat Wagon

WGB

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #1 on: 26 August 2011, 04:33 PM »
You need a pair of standard rear springs (the SLS ones are softer and the hydraulics "help" them) and a pair of standard rear shock absorbers.

You will also need something to compress the rear spring for removal and installation.

The rest is whether or not your rear bushes are any good or not and how much of the pipework/reservoir/pump you wish to dismantle and remove.

There is a blanking plate for the pump opening which is probably fitted to all motors without SLS as I assume the pump will not be happy circulating without oil for long.

Bill.

chrismsullivan

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #2 on: 26 August 2011, 07:28 PM »
Thanks Bill.

Yes, that's what I figured was involved. I've done suspension work before on previous cars, so the work itself should be pretty straight forward for me.

I'm happy to swap out the pump for the oem blanking plate and leave everything in place for prosperity and the ability to change back in the future if so desired. I was also thinking that I may be able to keep the pump in place, but simply remove the spindle that drives the pump, effectively disabling it, and then mounting the pump and hoses back onto it to keep it all tidy.
What do you guys think of that theory?

Some might also ask why remove it? Well, the pump "might" be leaking back into the engine, there's a leak in the rear somewhere and I really don't have a need for the SLS at the moment. No towing, no heavy loads. Just a straight line comfort cruising machine is what I've planned. So springs and struts will be a more reliable, low maintenance option.

All I need to really know about are any pitfalls, precautions, tricks, parts required e.t.c.

So far as I'm aware, I'll need:
New springs
New struts
Spring compressor

Will the struts directly replace the bags?

I guess I was looking for the thread on the 280se that went through this process to avoid asking too many questions.
1976 W116 280SE - Project car
1969 W108 280SE - So sad I sold it in a fit of stupid youthiness.
1970 W108 280S - Project car - GONE!
MY08 Subaru Liberty - Daily faithful
2007 B6 TDi VW Passat Wagon

koan

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #3 on: 27 August 2011, 03:44 AM »
I'm happy to swap out the pump for the oem blanking plate and leave everything in place for prosperity and the ability to change back in the future if so desired. I was also thinking that I may be able to keep the pump in place, but simply remove the spindle that drives the pump, effectively disabling it, and then mounting the pump and hoses back onto it to keep it all tidy.
What do you guys think of that theory?

I think on a 280 engine if the flat notched driving piece is removed the pump will not be driven.

On 6.9 and maybe 450 the pump is still driven if the piece is removed.

koan

Boogity, Boogity, Boogity, Amen!

chrismsullivan

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #4 on: 27 August 2011, 04:10 AM »
Thanks Koan.

That's exactly what I was thinking. That'd save sourcing a blanking plate and keep everything tidy as far as the original SLS parts go.

As far as new shocks go, can anyone confirm whether standard gas shocks will slot in and bolt up once the hydraulic ones are removed?
« Last Edit: 27 August 2011, 04:14 AM by chrismsullivan »
1976 W116 280SE - Project car
1969 W108 280SE - So sad I sold it in a fit of stupid youthiness.
1970 W108 280S - Project car - GONE!
MY08 Subaru Liberty - Daily faithful
2007 B6 TDi VW Passat Wagon

oscar

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #5 on: 27 August 2011, 06:46 AM »
Anytime you look up shocks for w116s online there's usually only the non sls type, so getting the shocks wont be a problem and although I can't quote numbers off hand from Pedders, I know they have suitable shocks as will a number of other aftermarket suppliers and yes they will bolt right in.   

For springs though, again Pedders and the like might stock something suitable and there was an Aussie co on ebay advertising a while back for any spring you like, std, high and lowered for a w116. I'm sure this is the mob
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Ultra-REAR-Springs-Mercedes-W116-280-350-450-S-SE-SEL-/220675239218?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item336144ed32

I didn't convert my 280S from hydro but did replace the conventional gear with W126 conventional AMG rear springs and shocks which also slot right in.  So w126 rear springs and shocks fit w116s.  Although I don't know how many conventional sprung W126s are out there in wrecker yards, if you go the 2nd hand route for springs, you can source w126 bits as well to convert or search for conventional w126 springs new.  Here's that link. http://forum.w116.org/mechanicals/conventional-w126-springs-and-shocks-on-a-w116-(amg)/msg62603/#msg62603

Ditto what koan says about the whatsamacallit that links the drive and the pump.  It's a different shape to the V8s and without it the pump doesn't spin for an m110, so I'd just take it out and leave the pump on so no need to find a blanking plate.

An m110's


A v8's








1973 350SE, my first & fave

oscar

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #6 on: 27 August 2011, 07:10 AM »
I just realised in that link to my w126 springs/shocks I said "I'm sure it's been answered whether W126 suspension can be fitted to a W116 and in short, everything except the front springs fit.  No idea about self levelling/hydro setups, this is just purely for conventional suspension."

Since that time I compared rear struts and a conventional rear shock and the springs,  they will fit.  You can even reuse the same bolts, nuts and metal washer and rubber grommets.

That link also shows the spring compressor in use.  To reinforce wgb's comments, you can't really do it without it unless you drop the subframe which isn't worth the hassle and "normal" claw type spring compressor simply don't fit.  The kit from the US is under $200 I see now. It used to be $300.  In Aus after a few searches I see the exact same kit for $400 and $500 even.  a'holes!
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370536654079&clk_rvr_id=259733492775&item=370536654079



« Last Edit: 27 August 2011, 07:12 AM by oscar »
1973 350SE, my first & fave

chrismsullivan

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #7 on: 27 August 2011, 02:19 PM »
Thanks a million Oscar!

I'm glad we are all in agreeance with the removal of the "whatsamacallit" in favour of completely removing the pump for a blanking plate. Haha.  ;)

Good confirmation on the pedders info too. I've already tracked down the info on struts and springs from there, so that much will be easy. I might even toy with the idea of renewing the front struts and springs at the same time.

I'll check out those links you've supplied though, especially the one relating to the compressor. It will be an essential item I think, especially for the front springs.

Thanks again.
Chris
1976 W116 280SE - Project car
1969 W108 280SE - So sad I sold it in a fit of stupid youthiness.
1970 W108 280S - Project car - GONE!
MY08 Subaru Liberty - Daily faithful
2007 B6 TDi VW Passat Wagon

chrismsullivan

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #8 on: 27 August 2011, 03:34 PM »
After doing some research on those compressors, they are cheaper out of the US, but postage will see them costing float to the $400 mark. So not far off the shelf price in Aus.
I've also found a place that hires the compressor: http://www.automotivetoolhire.com/Mercedes/Chassis/p-251

A place that sells them here in VIC (see part number 084500): http://www.tridon.com.au/Products/Product.aspx?SG=6&S=25&G=60522&P=68820

And finally: http://www.toolworks.com.au/j6912-front-coil-spring-compressor-kit.html

1976 W116 280SE - Project car
1969 W108 280SE - So sad I sold it in a fit of stupid youthiness.
1970 W108 280S - Project car - GONE!
MY08 Subaru Liberty - Daily faithful
2007 B6 TDi VW Passat Wagon

WGB

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I paid about the same price for my compressor (when the dollar was about 85 cents) but I don't remember the postage being that damaging ($89 from memory) but I did buy some other tools off the same person at the same time as shown in the photo.



You can ask them for "expedited" rates - just means next business day delivery over normal rates - and this reduces the cost substantially.

Anyway best of luck and do use a suitable spring compressor - your life and limb is worth it.

Bill


1980sdga

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Re: Looking for a particular thread/info
« Reply #10 on: 27 August 2011, 06:54 PM »
Just a straight line comfort cruising machine is what I've planned.

That's what my 116's are  8)  I'd love to experience SLS but the suspension on my cars is more than adequate.

Not too bad in the twisties for a big car either!
Jon


Little by little I have grown fond of the infamous Auto Temp II we have in our 116's

chrismsullivan

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I've just received a quote from pedders for a set of new rear shocks and springs.

302 for the shocks.
185 for the springs.

That seems a little expensive for generic pedders items don't you think?

Considering I can get Sachs shocks delivered from the UK for around $150, it would seem that Pedders are having a laugh.

Does anyone have any recommendations as to places in Oz in which haws reasonably priced suspension components?

Cheers,
Chris

1976 W116 280SE - Project car
1969 W108 280SE - So sad I sold it in a fit of stupid youthiness.
1970 W108 280S - Project car - GONE!
MY08 Subaru Liberty - Daily faithful
2007 B6 TDi VW Passat Wagon

oscar

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Are all those prices per pair or one of each?  If for a pair I would've thought the prices weren't good, particularly the springs.
Billsteins aren't any cheaper but the quality and OEM connection's there.  They're maybe $200+ each locally, I can't remember.  There should be a few agents in Melb to source Billies so you wont have a problem getting an idea of pricing.  Even Supercheap can order them in. B46-0511 sport/heavy duty.  B46-1184 standard/comfort.
Monroe's another option.  They were on the front of that wreck I disposed of recently and when  I searched Monroe's website at work a couple of days ago they stock rears too E5306. 

I see others like KYB and Koni make w116 shocks but I know nothing about their quality.   Just try to avoid a cheap fix here.  Do some research on what makes a good shock absorber and where the quality lies with each brand.  My old Sachs shocks on the 280S were really crap compared to the billies I put in. They were too easy to compress and had dead space/freeplay.  Yes they were old but so are the billsteins that replaced them.
1973 350SE, my first & fave

chrismsullivan

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Thanks Oscar.

Those prices are for pairs, not individual pieces.

Upon a bit further research, it would seem that my best local options are Bilstein, pedders and Monroe. There are likely to be other options, but these all seem to be the most frequently used applications. I'm not in a huge rush at the moment, so will do a bit more research.

I've install Bilsteins on a previous car and they were fantastic, so might head down that road again.

Hey, Oscar... If you get a chance, take a look at my other thread relating to the CSV and AAV. I've got a few questions in there that I wouldn't mind receiving your opinion on.

Cheers
Chris
1976 W116 280SE - Project car
1969 W108 280SE - So sad I sold it in a fit of stupid youthiness.
1970 W108 280S - Project car - GONE!
MY08 Subaru Liberty - Daily faithful
2007 B6 TDi VW Passat Wagon

oscar

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Yeah I was about to reply to that other thread but xfactor was about to start ::) ;D
Will go there now.
1973 350SE, my first & fave