Why Hankook tires suck

[Casey]

Some tires work better at higher pressures than the OEM items.    I used to stick exactly to the tire placard until the Exlporer/Firestone debacle.  there was a lot of discussion in the industry after that and I ended up following the boss' opinion and went by the max figure on the sidewall.  If they indicate a max of 44 on the sidewall,  you could try that and see what they feel like.  You just never know.   I expect that you also have had the alignment checked, correct?  We set my 300SD up with about 1/2 degree negative camber, nearly zero toe then put on as much caster as I had left.  Turned in pretty nice.

I don't know anything about camber or whatever else.  No haven't checked alignment but it doesn't matter - they act just as bad on totally different cars - that's a 1974 450SE in the videos.  Not really looking for a magic fix.  I could try more air in the tires but frankly that idea scares the hell out of me because they are already the most dangerous tires I have for rainy weather driving - they slip and slide very very easily as it is.

What was the Explorer/Firestone debacle?

[Beastie]

Some tires work better at higher pressures than the OEM items.    I used to stick exactly to the tire placard until the Exlporer/Firestone debacle.  there was a lot of discussion in the industry after that and I ended up following the boss' opinion and went by the max figure on the sidewall.

I do this as well. I feel more comfortable going by the recommendations of the tyre manufacturer than the car manufacturer. The tyre pressures listed in the owners manual are lower limits, for comfort and predictable handling and grip. There's no danger in going a little higher. There's no real risk to the car in running higher pressures and there's no risk to the tyre itself as long as you do not exceed the maximum listed on the sidewall. Just don't go nuts.

From the owners manual, page 60: "Tyre pressures listed for light loads are minimum values offering high driving comfort. Increased inflation pressures for heavy loads produce favorable handling characteristics with lighter loads and are perfectly permissible. The ride of the vehicle, however, will become somewhat harder."

If I recall correctly, the recommended pressure for a light load is 30psi front, 32psi rear. As I normally drive at low to medium speeds, I'm not too worried about high-speed blow-outs so I've been playing around with different pressures to find a nice balance. Mine are currently 36psi front, 38psi at the rear. I've also tried 38 front, 40 rear. It is a noticeably firmer ride but the steering is sharper and a little more precise and the whole car's handling and roadholding feels a little more... sharp.

If you're having issues with ride or handling that you think is down to the tyres, it might be worth messing around with the pressures a little bit.


The Ford Explorer/Firestone debacle was a pretty big debacle. Many people were killed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firestone_and_Ford_tire_controversy

[TJ 450]

That sounds pretty terrible,

But I would have to say that not all Hankook tyres are crap, I've got a set on what is now my Brother's 190E and they are great.

It sounds like you need a new set of tyres!

Even the crap Chinese "Hero" tyres on my 280 don't do that.

I use 36PSI all round.

Tim

[ZCarFan]

Some tires work better at higher pressures than the OEM items.    I used to stick exactly to the tire placard until the Exlporer/Firestone debacle.  there was a lot of discussion in the industry after that and I ended up following the boss' opinion and went by the max figure on the sidewall.  If they indicate a max of 44 on the sidewall,  you could try that and see what they feel like.  You just never know.   I expect that you also have had the alignment checked, correct?  We set my 300SD up with about 1/2 degree negative camber, nearly zero toe then put on as much caster as I had left.  Turned in pretty nice.

I don't know anything about camber or whatever else.  No haven't checked alignment but it doesn't matter - they act just as bad on totally different cars - that's a 1974 450SE in the videos.  Not really looking for a magic fix.  I could try more air in the tires but frankly that idea scares the hell out of me because they are already the most dangerous tires I have for rainy weather driving - they slip and slide very very easily as it is.

What was the Explorer/Firestone debacle?

The 1st generation Explorers had a tire pressure spec of 26psi IIRC.  This was to make it ride less like the truck it really was so that the owners could look tough without having to be so.  In any event, incidents of rapid tire disintegration were becoming too commonplace as these things were driven around in 100+ temperatures at 80+ mph, overloaded, and often suffering from even further under inflation from neglect.  The sidewalls would get hotter and hotter until the whole works came apart at speed.  To make matters worse, many of the "want to look tough but aren't" drivers would freak out and stand on the brakes and try to initiate some wild, untrained emergency actions.  Naturally, they would then go flying off the road where the SUV would do fun things like barrel roll and pulpify the occupants.  Instead of just reissuing new specs and reminding people that just because they can do 80-90 in their SUV doesn't mean it's safe or that they have the skills to do so, people vilified both Ford and Firestone for "faulty" products.

Naturally, for those of us working in the tire biz, there was a lot of discussion about inflation pressures after the media fracas.  I will say, I can't think of anyone that still set the Exploders' tires to 26 psi after that one though. Hooo weeee.

Now, it seems that there were about 250 deaths attributed to the tires.  To put that in perspective, that's about 2 average days worth of fatalities in the U.S.  Most are caused by apathy and bad judgement.  Note that nobody will bat an eyelash at the daily toll, which has been ongoing for decades, because most people don't want to admit their own guilt in the matter, but if a tire manufacturer might have made some tires that were not as forgiving to misuse, all run around looking for a villain.

[oversize]

What was the Explorer/Firestone debacle?

Seriously??  I knew about that one and I'm in Australia!  Casey did you say how old the tyres are??  More that 5YO and they'll be hard anyway.  BTW yes I'd recommend pressures higher than those on the placard or in the manual and they should always be checked cold.

[Bandolero]

On my 6.9 I run 40 lbs in the front and 35 in the rear.
Less understeer and the tyres still wear flat across the tread.
I certainly get better roadholding at these settings than having them at lower pressure.
I found anything more than 36 in the rear would start to wear the centre of the tyre slightly.

On my 280SE I ran 38 front and 34 rear. Worked great.
None of the tyres squealed like that on the video at those pressures and I had great roadholding with even wear.

Jack up the pressure on the front tyres and try it. You've got nothing to lose as you can always lower them again.

[Tony66_au]

Another thing to consider is that the tyre placard info is based on 30 plus year old tyre technology which is way out of date now.

[Casey]

I filled them up to 40psi all around today (they're rated for 44psi max, not sure what "recommended" is), mainly because I was concerned about the marks on the sidewalls from turns rather than the squeals.  They still squeal on turns but I have to try harder now whereas it was happening ridiculously easily before.  I enjoy the ride now a lot more, though they're still crappy tires and I'm sure will continue to be horrendous when it rains.  For the record this post had nothing to do with "how can I get better use out of crap tires", but rather, "please buy anything but these".

This goes against my logic though.  It would seem that less inflation would equal more surface area of rubber on the street, which would equal more traction.  Maybe bad for the tire sidewalls and safety when it comes to potential for tire failure, but how does higher pressure and less surface area increase traction?

[Bandolero]

I wouldn't run 40 on the rear as the rear of your car is lighter than the front and the rear tyres will wear in the centre if the pressure is too high.
I'd drop the rear pressure to 35 and monitor the wear pattern on the tyres.
Also, don't trust the garage air gauge, buy your own quality one.

[Casey]

I wouldn't run 40 on the rear as the rear of your car is lighter than the front and the rear tyres will wear in the centre if the pressure is too high.
I'd drop the rear pressure to 35 and monitor the wear pattern on the tyres.
Also, don't trust the garage air gauge, buy your own quality one.

I have such a one. The air compressor ends at my garage are just standard ones without built-in gauges. It's a bit tough to find good quality ones in this crazy era of cheap plastic gimmicks. :/

[Bandolero]

Haha!  You're not wrong there....

[entresz]

Hi Casey, my 450SE has hankooks on it. It squeals like yours does  too... even doing speeds as low as 40km/h.......

[oversize]

Ok have a look at this link and tell us how old your tyres are:

http://www.bridgestone.com.au/tyres/passenger/care/age.aspx

[John Hubertz]

Is that within the speed limit ?

over here there's no way we would be allowed to go that fast on a road like that

Built up roads like that are 50km/h or ~31mph

Usually the speed limit in town is 30 - 35 mph, but in most smaller communities there are no police.  In most states, speed cameras and fixed police traps are either illegal, or so unpopular it just isn't done.  Our Sheriffs are all elected officials, after all - and they are the only law on county roads and small towns.

In the countryside of the United States there are thousands and thousands of miles of beautifully paved secondary roads that were supplanted, first by the old State and National Routes (Route 66 for example), and then by the interstate highway system.

They usually have very unique names, like Wayne Trace, or my favorite, Paw Paw Pike.

They offer long, uninterrupted drives along the edges of rivers or along old wagon trails and settler's paths.

There is virtually *no* police presence on this type of road.  For example, when driving from Michigan to Indiana when I bought Max, I drove about 1/3 of the way on an old highway...  rolling hills, 35mph curves, 55mph on the straights.  I suppose I averaged about 75 mph.



Of course, attention is required, but honestly, here in the states, the only penalty for driving fast outside large cities is death and injury.

In a few states, driving off the road by accident or hitting an object is a punishable offence, usually 3 points (out of 12 or so) off your license and about a $200 USD fine.  Most states have no problem with accidents, as long as you or your insurance company pays for any damages.

Even chronic drunks can drive around here - up to three times over .08 is only a 2 year suspension (6 months 1st, 12 months 2nd, 24 months 3rd).  However, if you can afford a lawyer, you can stretch that to 8 or 10 incidents.



This is truly heaven for lovers of the automobile.  I'm just sad that so many of the former British Commonwealth countries have followed their lead into nanny-state automated enforcement and ridiculous standards for operating an automobile.

I'd say at least 60% of the vehicles operated in this state would not pass any form of safety inspection.  And I mean ANY form of rational inspection.

I'm not a xenophobe... but in this one category, God Bless the good old U.S. of A!

[Tony66_au]

I drove in Colorado and from there into Edmonton Canada years ago and once you get used to the differences its a nice place to drive, the Roads are awesome quality and the only hassle was a run in with local cops when an elderly woman backed into me in a car park but fortunately witnesses hung around long enough to convince the cops I wasn't at fault and there was no damage to the Ford i was driving so they let me go.

In built up urban areas the cops do sneak about and tend to hide on the outskirts but compared to the methods LEA use in Australia its a breeze driving in the US once you get over the freakiness of being able to be locked up and front a judge for a minor traffic violation lol