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Euro light question

Started by 1980sdga, 15 December 2011, 09:54 AM

Casey

Quote from: 1980sdga on 16 December 2011, 07:12 PM
Nothing sexy about the sound of a 617 though  ???

I disagree!  Nothing says "Mercedes" like the sound of an OM617...

The other night I was at my garage and I heard a 300D pull up out front (a random passerby who'd spotted old Mercedes and decided to stop for a visit).  I knew it was a Mercedes before I ever saw it or who it was (I'd never seen the car before), simply because of the sound.  The 450's have a very nice rumble to them, but it's not as distinct of a sound.  I haven't ever heard a 350 or 280.

1980sdga

Any pointers on wiring this up?  I'll be going with headlight wipers as well which will mean plumbing and electrics !

ckamila

Quote from: Squiggle Dog on 16 December 2011, 11:51 AM
Yes, if you install Euro headlights, your intake will be sealed off, which will cause the car to lose power and smoke. No one on the other forums would believe me because they had W123s and 126s.


I do have euro's installed by PO (originals in box). Explain the smoke and loss of power.

I have more smoke on my 116 (170K miles) than on the 123 (235K with about 85K on rebuild) - 123 has better compression and the 116 has a little more blow-by.
If it's not broke i haven't fix it yet...


1980 300SD, 170K
1985 300D, 235K

Squiggle Dog

Quote from: ckamila on 03 February 2012, 12:33 AM
I do have euro's installed by PO (originals in box). Explain the smoke and loss of power.

The 300SD was designed only for USA headlights. It sucks in air from the sides of the floating USA headlights. If you install Euro headlights, they seal off the air intake, so the engine has no way of breathing except for pinholes in the sheet metal. This starves the engine of air, like trying to suck air out of a vacuum. If the engine doesn't get enough air it will cause smoke and lessened fuel economy.
Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+

Squiggle Dog

To better illustrate this, here are pictures of a 1979 300SD I used to own. Right after installing the Euro headlights I discovered that the car lacked power and smoked. There was intense skepticism on this, even from long-time experts in the forum who thought I didn't know what I was talking about.

The funnel behind the headlight is where the engine takes in air.


The USA headlights float and allow air to come in behind them from the sides.



The Euro headlights fit flush against the body and use seals so that they are air-tight. Air cannot get past the headlights to get to the intake funnel.


The only way the engine can run at all is because of small drain holes, however this is not adequate for full performance.

Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+

ckamila

Squiggle Dog - Thanks for the pictures. I will give your modification a go and re-route my air intake hose once i put the interior back together.

chris
If it's not broke i haven't fix it yet...


1980 300SD, 170K
1985 300D, 235K

1980sdga

Good pics Squig!  It was pretty obvious to me that it wasn't going to work when I got into mine.

I was thinking about drilling holes in the rear cover to allow air from near the washer reservoir to feed the engine.  Any thoughts on this?

It may not be a good idea pulling air through the headlight...

There is also a louvred panel beneath the headlight that funnels air through a duct that ends in the bottom of the battery tray.  I lost that when I installed  the wiper motors.  Any input on why MB thought the SD's needed such a well ventilated battery?

Squiggle Dog

The rear light covers keep water running off the hood from getting into the headlight areas and fogging up the lenses and damaging the lights. Drilling a hole would defeat this purpose unless it was either drilled where water couldn't get in, or there was a duct sealed to it and rerouted somewhere. Water from the hood tends to drip right onto the rear light covers.

The battery cooler might not be necessary in cold climates, but from what I've researched, heat is the number one killer of diesel batteries. Keeping the battery cool under operation will help it to last longer. In a warm climate, this is even more important.

There is an urban legend that in one of The Star Magazines there is an article on installing Euro headlights in the 300SD and rerouting the air intake, with plans from MB on doing it properly. However, so far no one has produced the article.
Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+

Casey

I fail to see what the problem is with just tossing the plastic hose or leaving it like Squiggle has it - the gas engines and NA diesels did not have any air intake other than under the hood.  The radiator, huge openings under the engine bay, and cracks along the hood edges allow plenty of air to be available at any time.

ckamila

So if euro's were not designed with 116 300SD in mind, what model was the target since the design of sealed lens defeats any air intake? What's the purpose for the vent on the back of the assembly if not for air intake?

chris
If it's not broke i haven't fix it yet...


1980 300SD, 170K
1985 300D, 235K

Squiggle Dog

Quote from: ckamila on 04 February 2012, 10:01 AM
So if euro's were not designed with 116 300SD in mind, what model was the target since the design of sealed lens defeats any air intake? What's the purpose for the vent on the back of the assembly if not for air intake?

chris

Every model but the 300SD (280S, 280SE, 280SEL, 350SE, 350SEL, 450SE, 450SEL, and 450SEL 6.9) could have come with Euro headlights. The 300SD was only sold in North America and only came with USA headlights, and is the only model that takes in air from behind the headlights. I'm not sure to which vent you're referring, but the drain holes are intended for letting trapped water escape from the body.
Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+

Squiggle Dog

Also, the 300SD is the only model that has the air intake funnel behind the headlight.
Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+

ckamila

#27
Squiggle Dog - I was referring to your post #19 of this thread. The vent located on the right side of the head light assembly shown below. The one we've inadvertently (at least me) connected the air filter inlet hose to, or the PO did as that's the way it came in my case.

My car lacks power and smokes i believe more than it should. Also, the boost pressure is low at around 6.5 -7psi. I am thinking this will solve some if not most of my problems.

If it's not broke i haven't fix it yet...


1980 300SD, 170K
1985 300D, 235K

JasonP



You guys are so smart.




"I love you guys."


1979 300SD
Color: 623H "Light Ivory"
1979 300SD
Color: 861H "Silver Green Metallic"
1977 280 E
Color: 606G "Maple Yellow"
-------------------------------------------

Squiggle Dog

That vent is for air intake. Only the 300SD has it. But, it becomes useless once you install Euro lights. I put a large black aerosol can cap over mine to keep water from running into it.
Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+