News:

Please add your location to your profile. It will help others to help you!

Main Menu

Door ducts

Started by 1980sdga, 22 October 2011, 06:53 PM

arman

Silly me thought that all w116's had corduroy cloth in the door trim. But obviously this is not the case. What type of material do the leather interiors have, where I have my corduroy cloth? Is that perforated leather just like MB tex has perforated material? And how does the back door trim look in case of MB tex or leather, non-perforated?
1974 W116 450 SEL 340.000km
Black exterior (040), olive green velours interior (966)
[url="http://gallery.w116.org/v/show_room/Armans450sel/"]http://gallery.w116.org/v/show_room/Armans450sel/[/url]

nathan

nice subject, cant believe only one of you is right and MT is so wrong!
that airduct brings the heated air into the door and rises up onto the front of the window so it defrosts. next time someone is driving in cold weather, crank your heaters and put the up defrost vents on and you will see this area defrosts on the window so you can view the outside rear view mirrors.
nathan
1979 116 6.9 #6436
2018 213 e63
2011 212 e63
2011 463 g55
2007 211 e500 wagen
1995 124 e320 cabriolet
1983 460 300gd
1981 123 280te

Gerard

Quote from: arman on 24 October 2011, 08:58 AM
Silly me thought that all w116's had corduroy cloth in the door trim. But obviously this is not the case. What type of material do the leather interiors have, where I have my corduroy cloth? Is that perforated leather just like MB tex has perforated material? And how does the back door trim look in case of MB tex or leather, non-perforated?

My car had leather seats, but the perforated material on the door looked like vinyl or leatherette, it was perforated.

I had the door card off the passenger door once, and I had a quick look to see where air exited, but couldn't see anything obvious.  It must be through those perforations, or else through gaps near the window seal, on the inside of the glass.  I agree that air was prevented from going into the door cavity, there was no vent in the polyboard of the door card, and there was the plastic sheet also behind it.   

Heating the door cavity would be a waste of heat.  Better to heat the interior or directly onto the persons feet or body.



TJ 450

I can visualise the system working through the heat rising from the door card and/or being directed up to where the anodised trim sits against the glass.

It obviously works though.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500

Squiggle Dog

It does indeed help keep the side windows defrosted, which is great if you have condensation from interior leaks. Also, I imagine it warms the mechanical parts of the window regulators so that they don't freeze up and not function.
Stop paying for animal cruelty and slaughter. Go vegan! [url="https://challenge22.com/"]https://challenge22.com/[/url]

1967 W110 Universal Wagon, Euro, Turbo Diesel, Tail Fins, 4 Speed Manual Column Shift, A/C
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel, DB479 Walnut Brown, Sunroof, Heated Seats, 350,000+

Big_Richard

the foam maybe open cell, but the wood its stuck to isnt  8)

Are we forgetting about that ?

Mforcer

#21
I had planned to retract my statement and agree with Major Tom but nathan suggests otherwise. Is nathan ever wrong?

According to the owner's manual: A continuous draught-free flow of air is supplied through indirect door ventilation even when all the levers are in the position "closed".

I still don't understand what the engineers were trying to achieve by running the vent into a piece of wood covered in foam and perforated vinyl. The air flow would be severely restricted and unless there is air flow there is no cooling/heating.

I would also expect any perceived demisting of the side windows would be a result of airflow out the dash vents just under the windows.
Michael
1977 450SE [Brilliant Red]
2006 B200

Big_Richard

Its good that their design is still the topic of much discussion and still not fully understood after 40 years  8)

TJ 450

Quote from: Major Tom 6.9 on 24 October 2011, 05:43 PM
the foam maybe open cell, but the wood its stuck to isnt  8)

Are we forgetting about that ?
Exactly, the fibreboard acts as a barrier... I'll show you a front door trim next weekend if I remember.

Tim
1976 450SEL 6.9 1432
1969 300SEL 6.3 1394
2003 ML500

arman

#24
Yes I agree that the fibre board is the barrier and channels the ventilation air through the very open cell sheet and out through the perforated vinyl (leather interior) or (corduroy-)cloth material (velour or MB tex interior). I can understand why they call it 'draft free' this way.
But I don't see how this air can get to the inside of the window without first leaving the cloth/vinyl on the inside of the door? I would think that aiming the side ventilation directly to the side window would be a lot faster defrosting or demisting.

See here what some articles in the w116.org's library say about the front door vent ducts:
http://www.w116.org/library/autocar7307 (See text block besides 1st aid kit):
"All the running controls, like the indicators, wipers, washers, headlamp flashers and lamps are worked by a right-hand stalk and an adjacent rotary knob. On the left in the central console are the heater controls, above the position for the radio. Four vertical slides regulate temperature, independently for each side of the car, and distribution with a multi- speed fan switch between each pair. Pushing all slides up automatically gives maximum demisting. Independent of the heater is a com- prehensive fresh-air system with four face level outlets, all adjustable for volume and angle. Special ducts pipe hot air to the inner skin of the door trim pads where it forms a thermal envelope and incidentally keeps the door cavities free from moisture."

http://www.w116.org/library/autocar7405 (See text block besides the interior photo under 'Equipment'):
"No air conditioning equipment was fitted to the test car. The heater, however, behaved very well. Ample heat is available, and the distribution is good. Particularly appreciated is the ducting of hot air into the front door cavities - a feature which effectively demists and de-ices the side windows. So far as could be ascertained, there is no provision for ducting hot air into the rear footwells. The blower has four speeds, all but the highest of which (labelled "Defrost") are unobtrusive. Sensibly, the blower is arranged to boost the flow of cold air through the face-level vents."

Here is a link to what I think could be a suitable sheet of foam, if you ever want to renew the disintegrated original foam sheet: http://www.fipitaly.it/index.php?area=32&CTLGFIPIDC=97&CTLGFIPIDP=470.

It may sound thick however with 10mm but I think it is quite soft and will be compressed a little between cloth/vinyl and fibre board. It has to be really open to let the air through and out of perforated vinyl.

If you want to find an example of the foam type used in the front door trim, there might be left some similar sheet of it in the ventilation openings behind the shiny trim on the outside behind the back door. It should be there originally but it probably has also fallen into pieces and blown away after all these years.
1974 W116 450 SEL 340.000km
Black exterior (040), olive green velours interior (966)
[url="http://gallery.w116.org/v/show_room/Armans450sel/"]http://gallery.w116.org/v/show_room/Armans450sel/[/url]

wacotech

Interesting discussion - let's revive it!
I noticed the door air supply is from the foot level ducting, so all up in def mode will not put air into the doors.

I noticed when i had one door apart there is a small but precise gap at the base of the glass all along the top of the door trim.

Also I agree there seems to be some porous material in part of the door trim.

My feeling is the primary reason was to keep side windows clear of moisture - but this would also increase warmth for driver or passenger.

What is this about different controls for left & right side? my 280SE doesn't have this; was this on higher spec cars?