Author Topic: baffle plate  (Read 15826 times)

daantjie

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #90 on: 12 October 2017, 08:23 AM »
No good deed goes unpunished ;D
Daniel
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rumb

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #91 on: 10 December 2017, 10:06 AM »
Met with company in Seattle that can produce the baffle plate for a price that I think will work.

They will scan part, size for shrinkage, 3d print one master and make urethane mold.  I have several materials I need to review that are probably tougher than the original to determine.  Will produce 40-50, what ever the mold can withstand.

TJ has posted his old part to me that I will send on to Seattle. Need to work on packaging and estimates of shipping costs.

I think we will be seeing this part available 1Q of next year.

rumb
'68 250S, '77 6.9 euro, '91 300SE, '98 SL500 '14 CLS550

floyd111

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #92 on: 10 December 2017, 03:35 PM »
You have an indication of the costs?  Even if you can get the molds as cheap as the Chinese have on offer (10thou), it's gonna be a very costly affair, with molding write-off per unit starting at 250usd per baffle at 40 units. That work is pre-paid, and if the final product is off by as little as 5mm, you're at a big loss with little hope for warranty. You'd be shipping international, national, and again, international.
I would not have that risk in Taiwan, but with molding costs at 12500, and a guaranteed 50 units, I'd be at 250usd as well,before local shipping, packaging and international shipping. I wasn't planning on making a profit, but clients would still be paying hefty prices in the end.
If you were to produce only 40 of them, costs would go up by another 20%
I have not heard 40, nor 50 .org guys here volunteering to pay that much, and if you don't sell all of them, again you'd be at a loss.
Wouldn't you want to check your clientele first, before investing that much?

rumb

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #93 on: 10 December 2017, 06:20 PM »
time will tell if I'm the hero or the fool. I would guess that >70% of 6.9's are missing this part. To me that is a market. 


'68 250S, '77 6.9 euro, '91 300SE, '98 SL500 '14 CLS550

Squiggle Dog

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #94 on: 10 December 2017, 09:45 PM »
I would buy one of those and pay the asking price if I weren't in such a bad financial situation. It would be a good pairing with my skid plate.
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floyd111

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #95 on: 11 December 2017, 06:02 AM »
In the light of shipping costs only going up by a fraction, if ordering 3-in-one-go, one could order 3 spoilers in carbon or fiber, for the price of 1 spoiler in urethane.
With installation of such spoilers being so easy, how long would 3 spoilers last  before all 3 would have been damaged beyond repair?
And, there is no such thing as damage-proof urethane neither. I have cracked many of such bumpers and spoilers over the years.
I am just saying, I wish you well, and I hope you won't be digging yourself into a pit with this venture.
My experience is that the actual percentage of W116 owners willing to pay top dollar for non-essential parts is really low. My gut tells me that selling a perfectly-shaped replacement at 3x less money has a 10-fold better chance of selling.
I am one of those madmen willing to go the extra mile with my cars, but I would never buy a urethane at 600 if I could get a carbon or fiber version for 2 or 300 bucks. Once sprayed, nobody would be able to tell the difference. I would only need to be given the warranty of a perfect fit.

tcj

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #96 on: 11 December 2017, 06:21 AM »
urethane - carbon - fiber
Please consider weather it brakes with sharp edges.
As this may exposes additional danger to a person you hit in an accident.
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floyd111

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #97 on: 11 December 2017, 06:32 AM »
The very rules that apply in Europe now are such that all new cars are shaped in basically the same way, when it comes to the nose, bonnet height and related. Carbon parts are used more on expensive, fast cars then on nissans, and little or no word on those racing parts in carbon. What is considered above everything else when it comes to pedestrians's safety is the angle of the grille and main bumper, and the height of the bonnet. Little attention to what happens underneath the main bumper.
I would say that this specific baffle plate's shape and location is not a source for concern, in this specific version. On that same note, driving a W116 is a threat to all pedestrians in countless ways, because it was built decades before security standards like these were invented. If pedestrian safety is one's goal, buying a Nissan March is probably one's best bet.

ptashek

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #98 on: 11 December 2017, 01:44 PM »
Also, to sell a part like this in Europe it must have the "CE" safety mark, otherwise it's illegal to sell in EU countries.

Additionally, to the best of my knowledge, in Germany a KBA (Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt) approval is required, otherwise it's illegal to use on a car, and will fail the TÜV immediately as such aftermarket accessories must be entered in the registration papers (so called "Brief").
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floyd111

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #99 on: 11 December 2017, 02:43 PM »
Indeed, this is a thing, but would you expect such laws to be upheld if a German were to privately import 1-3 units? That would be a bummer.

ptashek

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #100 on: 12 December 2017, 01:19 AM »
Indeed, this is a thing, but would you expect such laws to be upheld if a German were to privately import 1-3 units? That would be a bummer.

I've had a quick look around their site, but can't find anything super specific, but I believe the requirements apply to manufactures rather than individuals obtaining a permit directly  (ABE).

https://www.kba.de/DE/Home/home_node.html ist the agency's website, maybe someone more local can get exact details. Not that it's critical for this project, just an interesting point in the wider context :)
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UTn_boy

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #101 on: 12 December 2017, 10:41 AM »
In the light of shipping costs only going up by a fraction, if ordering 3-in-one-go, one could order 3 spoilers in carbon or fiber, for the price of 1 spoiler in urethane.
With installation of such spoilers being so easy, how long would 3 spoilers last  before all 3 would have been damaged beyond repair?
And, there is no such thing as damage-proof urethane neither. I have cracked many of such bumpers and spoilers over the years.
I am just saying, I wish you well, and I hope you won't be digging yourself into a pit with this venture.
My experience is that the actual percentage of W116 owners willing to pay top dollar for non-essential parts is really low. My gut tells me that selling a perfectly-shaped replacement at 3x less money has a 10-fold better chance of selling.
I am one of those madmen willing to go the extra mile with my cars, but I would never buy a urethane at 600 if I could get a carbon or fiber version for 2 or 300 bucks. Once sprayed, nobody would be able to tell the difference. I would only need to be given the warranty of a perfect fit.

But these weren't ever sprayed or painted when new.  They were matte black.  Could the material they're made from be made the correct shade/sheen of black before they're formed?  Also, even though the carbon fiber is less expensive to manufacture, it'll still break easier than the original material.  Typically, this would be of no consequence, but since this piece is in such a vulnerable spot that can snag anything at any given time wouldn't it make sense to have them made out of a material that is as good as the original or better?  Just thinking out loud here.  :)   
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rumb

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #102 on: 12 December 2017, 12:51 PM »
I am looking at 3 different materials, the 1st choice is a material that would be stonger/flexible than the original, but still retain the color and    finish.   Will examine possibly making it a bit thicker also.

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floyd111

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #103 on: 13 December 2017, 06:52 AM »
As far as i know, both Fiber and carbon allow for coloring mixed in with the resin. With glassfiber it is very commonly done in all sorts of full colors, with a finish that does not show you what material it was made of. With carbon, most people prefer to see that it's carbon.
We distribute BST carbon wheels here in Taiwan, and these are now available in red and blue as well. Matt black has been around forever., be it that the fiber within remains visible in all 3 optional colors. I expect that a (fe) full bright red is not possible, but adding darkness to the resin should be pretty easy, like overdoing the matt finish. I'd have to check the exact details.

daantjie

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Re: baffle plate
« Reply #104 on: 13 December 2017, 08:04 AM »
My 2c on this would be to have the cheapest material that would allow for faithful reproduction in large enough numbers to make it viable.  Longevity really should not be of not too much concern as these things get wiped out constantly, so why drop big coin on "exotic" materials if it's not "needed"?
Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9 - Astralsilber