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Community => Auto Torque => Topic started by: beagle2022 on 08 March 2017, 01:53 AM

Title: Just bought a W140
Post by: beagle2022 on 08 March 2017, 01:53 AM
I just bought a 1993 S320 W140.  260,000kms.  Good service record and well kept.  A few parking lot dings and scratches, but nothing major. All the electrics work and the wiring harnesses are in good shape.  Quite a change from the W116.  Very quiet and the seats are ridiculously comfortable.  Nothing needs attention immediately other than the owners have lost the security code for the sound system (Becker) after some battery problems. 

An interesting feature is that is has two batteries (!!).  The extra one was installed professionally when the previous owner had a few strandings with flat battery issues.  There is a small switch under the dash that lets you choose which one you use to start the car.  Both charge in normal operation.  There is enough grunt between them to jump start an aircraft carrier.

These cars are right at the bottom of the depreciation curve, so I think it would be hard to lose money over the next few years.  I am looking forward to some long trips in it over the coming months.

Any experiences or insights with this model?
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: gf on 08 March 2017, 03:16 AM
Nice!! Photos please. My experience is I get very jealous whenever I see one.
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: daantjie on 08 March 2017, 11:25 AM
Nice one!  when they first came out I must be honest I was not too chuffed with the W140 styling, but now I can easily see myself driving one, but it must be the 500, or perhaps this will be the "one V12 every  man should own in their lifetime" for me 8)
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: Peter on 08 March 2017, 04:06 PM
A really nicely styled car. I owned one for many years and as you say the seats are perfect and the sounds system is impressive. My only real expense was replacing the engine wiring harness which is the common fault with the 140. I still have a full set of books/manuals and the MB folder if you need them (let me know) and it has the radio code  ;D
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: Zaxxon on 08 March 2017, 09:30 PM
I had a couple 140s until just a little while ago - sold the '96 S420, but still have the '99 CL500 which I probably will never sell. Those cars really are amazing machines and offer a ride, sound level and comfort that I am still unable to find even in much newer S-Class models. My '99 is in really nice condition I'd say, even though it has now over 70k on it. The car is fully optioned aside from the auxiliary heater and window shades, which I don't know if they were offered in the coupe and I spent about 4 years to get it back to it's former glory. Some of the things that usually go wrong are the heater duo valve, blower regulator, on the inline 6 the head gasket, sometimes broken springs in the front, but usually more so on the V8, and before '96, the biodegradable wiring harnesses. Oh, and the mirror wiring harnesses melt down sometimes - insulation just crumbles. Aside from that, they are amazing cars and full of incredible engineering for the age...

--Zax
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: gf on 10 March 2017, 12:10 AM
Anyone suspect what the long term running costs might be over the next decade? I'm suspecting it will be a fair bit more than a w116. Hence my reluctance to get one. Even though they're a dream car for me
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: s class on 10 March 2017, 05:54 AM
10 years ago I had a higher mileage 500SEL that was a bit neglected and problematic, but wow what a machine.  THe only car I've ever driven/owned that I would say was actually better than a 116.  I would love to get another one. 
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: beagle2022 on 13 March 2017, 06:02 AM
Here are some photos.  Not sure if I have posted them properly.  I chose small file sizes to be safe
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: daantjie on 13 March 2017, 09:06 AM
Very nice indeed. Congratulations!
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: Harv on 13 March 2017, 12:32 PM
Wow. Lovely color.
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: daantjie on 13 March 2017, 11:21 PM
One thing that I've noted and maybe just because I am not a fan of light interiors, is that it is rare to find a dark interior on a 140 or 126. Must have been a trend as now the trend seems to be darker interiors. I love a light exterior like silver matched with dark interior such as the 202 leather on the 116 or even better, black. To each their own ;D
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: gf on 16 March 2017, 04:32 AM
Yep that was a trend up till the early 2000s, just like blue interiors up till 1990. Black is all the rage now.
Gosh those seats make me feel relaxed just looking at them. Have you taken it for many drives yet?
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: beagle2022 on 16 March 2017, 06:35 AM
GF, I have barely driven it.  I picked it up on Monday afternoon and headed out of town on business the next morning.  I get home on this Sunday night and fly out again on Monday night.  So it sits unloved until next Wednesday.  I'll give it a basic service and plan to take it on a long trip the following weekend.  I'll let you know how it goes.
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: beagle2022 on 04 April 2017, 07:53 PM
OK.  First impressions:
* It is built like a tank.  Heavy metal everywhere.  Double glazed windows.
* It is full of gadgets.  Why anyone needs a power operated rear view mirror is beyond me. So there are lots of fiddly things to go wrong in the future.
* It is insanely quiet.  Really. At any speed.
* To counter that, the sound system is amazing.  Ten speakers. Separate power amp for the rear shelf ones.  10 stacker CD player.
* More power than I expected from a 3.2 hauling over 2 tons.
* It handles very well: big tyres and great suspension.
* The seats are phenomenally comfortable.  The power front seats adjust into almost any conceivable position and are supportive even after 25 years of use. The adjustable steering wheel is a bonus.
* The engine bay is uncluttered and everything is easy to access.
* As an early model is has KE jet injection.  So I'm not a total stranger to what is going on.
* Central locking etc is all vacuum operated.  (You can run but you can't hide!)
* Parts are pricier than w116, but not crazy: Distributor cap was $143. Rotor arm $66. Air filter $44.  All Aussie dollars.
These cars are where the w116 was 15 years ago in terms of market value.  A great buy at current prices.  It should last for years.
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: daantjie on 04 April 2017, 10:51 PM
Ugh you are tempting me now...currently 2 low miles s500's close to me here. I want one soooo baaaad :o
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: wbrian63 on 05 April 2017, 08:42 AM
My responses are based on my experiences with a 1992 300SE which I bought cheap, dumped a bank vault of money into and sold cheap, but wouldn't mind owning one again.
Quote from: beagle2022 on 04 April 2017, 07:53 PM
* It is full of gadgets.  Why anyone needs a power operated rear view mirror is beyond me. So there are lots of fiddly things to go wrong in the future.
The power operated rear view mirror disappeared after just a few years - I think 94 was the last model to have them. On my car, the mirror position was sync'd to the memory seat controls, just like the left and right-hand outside mirrors. That's a nifty benefit - until someone borrows the car and tries to move the mirror manually... :(
Quote from: beagle2022 on 04 April 2017, 07:53 PM
* It is insanely quiet.  Really. At any speed.
I owned an '02 S55 after the 92' 300SE. The '92 was a quieter car.
Quote from: beagle2022 on 04 April 2017, 07:53 PM
* More power than I expected from a 3.2 hauling over 2 tons.
Biggest problem for these cars was the 5-speed automatic that started in 2nd gear, just like the V8 4-speed units. My car was a complete dog off the line unless you put your foot all the way to the floor. Difference between the 5-speed and 4-speed units was it was easy to wire up a switch to cause the 4-speed unit to start in 1st always. The 5-speed 1st gear start was triggered by the transmission control module - no tinkering possible. Other thing that was an issue with the 3.2L engine is head gasket failures. I bought mine cheap from someone that got it from someone who wouldn't pay the price for a new head gasket. They did the work (poorly) and I wound up having it redone after about 30k miles. Worse, when they reattached the head, they left off the spacer washers under the head bolts, which ruined the head (and probably led to the premature gasket failure - many of the bolts were bottomed-out in the block) which added many dollars to the repair cost - I think the shop doing the work paid $750 for a used head.
Quote from: beagle2022 on 04 April 2017, 07:53 PM
* Central locking etc is all vacuum operated.  (You can run but you can't hide!)
Unless your car is different than mine, the system pneumatic, with a pump under the right-side rear seat doing all the work. It "blows" to unlock the doors and "sucks" to lock them. It also provides the pressure for the lumbar supports in the front seats and the myriad of servo pods on the HVAC system. There's was even a pneumatic actuated handle that would extend out from the boot lid above the license plate when you triggered the trunk release button. My car also had the rear "reversing guides" (stubby antennae) at the outside corners of the rear quarter panels, at the edges of the boot lid. This system extended the guides when the car was reversed and retracted them when the car was put back into park or a forward gear was selected. Funny story - when I bought the car, it had an aftermarket security system installed, which didn't work, so I removed it. Everything that was controlled by the pneumatic system was backwards - when you put the car in reverse, the reversing guides would retract - drive, they would extend. Close the trunk, the lift handle would extend - open it, the handle would retract. No longer had the factory remote, so using the key was the only way to lock the car. The backwards behavior also extended to the door locks - when you locked the car with the key, the lock knob would descend as you turned the key and as soon as you released the key back to the vertical position, all of the doors would unlock, but the security system would remain armed. I fought and fought with this for days until I decided to pull the pneumatic control unit out from under the rear seat. Opened the case up and found the power wires to the motor had been cut and reversed. I guess that the alarm installer did this for some reason. Put the wires back where they belonged and everything was fine after that...
One note - the pneumatic system has some "smarts" to it. If one zone, say the lumbar supports demands air for longer than a certain timeframe, the system will take that zone offline. To fix the problem, you have to first fix the leak, then pull the fuse to the pump system to reset it.

Enjoy the last of the Mercedes built "where cost was no object"...
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: daantjie on 05 April 2017, 10:20 AM
Seems like these can be had super cheap now, pretty much the lowest it will go on the depreciation curve methinks.  Obviously one can get badly burnt here with all the gizmo's, but sounds like the M119 motor in the S500 is bulletproof for the most part.  Now to convince the missus that I "need" another Benz ::)...
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: karmann_20v on 05 April 2017, 11:40 AM
Do it Daniel!!!!!!
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: daantjie on 05 April 2017, 12:30 PM
Tempted...
But the AC Evaporator issues seem to be plentiful online.  Kind of not if but when, and then the whole dash must come out :o  would have to make sure I can see documented proof that this has been done.  I do like rolling in ice cold comfort!
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: beagle2022 on 04 October 2017, 12:33 AM
OK, six months on and I thought I'd give you a more informed user update.

Things I love:
* It is incredibly quiet.
* The seats are very comfortable.
* It has a lot more power than my 280sel.  A lot.
* The stereo.  Fantastic.
* Handling and road feel.
* No rust.  Zip.
* Incredibly well thought-out engineering with ease of access to serviceable components.

Things that have gone wrong:
* The vacuum pump died.  Water got in somewhere.  That killed the central locking, seat firmness adjustment, headlight adjustment et al.
* The soft-closing door locks are intermittent.
* The residual heat function in the climate control is demon possessed.  It has turned itself on a few times and refuses to turn off.  I need to remove the fuse to stop it. Then it resets normally.
* The worm gear in the CD stacker died.

Things I don't like:
* Visibility of all four corners is awful, especially the rear. I've had a few "braille" moments.
* The fuel consumption around town.
* Complex electrics.  Front and rear fuse boxes. Stereo has headset in the dash and then separate tuner, amp and CD in the boot.

Overall reflections:
* This is a great car.  Great design and high quality materials. It feels like the W116's big brother. Not a cousin or in-law, which is what more modern Mercs feel like.
* It is a pleasure to drive, especially on the highway.
* The M104 is a fantastic engine.  Surprisingly powerful with good low-end torque. Mine has the early KE jet injection, so you can fix it with a hammer and chisel. Likewise the analogue auto transmission.
* For $4.5k it is a complete bargain and cannot possibly depreciate.
* Parts are easy to get and cheap: oil filter $8, rotor arm $55, distributor cap $135 (it's enormous), two rear discs $80, front indicator $25. I found a specialist in the USA who fixed the vacuum pump for $145USD.

So don't be scared. Any car that has made is this far in good condition will last forever with sensible maintenance.
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: TJ 450 on 07 October 2017, 08:29 AM
Sounds good,

Yes, if the W124 is anything to go by, the 140 should be fantastic, even if there are a few issues to fix.

Happy motoring..

Tim
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: beagle2022 on 07 October 2018, 06:17 AM
OK.  Another year on.
Still in love with this car.  Nothing major has gone wrong. I'm now 15,000 kms and two years into ownership.
Just did a 2,500km road trip.  Not a problem.  Minimal oil use. Coolant fine. Auto trans perfect. Climate control works fine. Average of 10 litres per 100 kms.  I think that is 30 mpg in the old money.
I miss the character of my 116, but the sophistication and engineering of the 140's is amazing.  And no rust issues.
I also miss this forum.  There is no W140 equivalent.  Mainly Russians with black window tint doing burnouts.  As Donald would say, "Sad".
Title: Re: Just bought a W140
Post by: irvine on 09 October 2018, 05:45 PM
Always wanted a w140 in Black. Defo on the must have list.

Neil.